Ideas to improve the criminal system

Thalstan

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Jun 5, 2016
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Thalstan
Hey all, I have a few idea on improving the criminal rating system, but before I post it to the CIG site, I would like to hear feadback on it from Test members.

1) Attacks or actions against NPCs/AIs would remain as is.

2) Actions against players now require the player to "file a complaint" against the person who performed the action, if that person does not already have a crimestat.

2a) If an action occurs in monitored space, no "proof" of the action is needed. The crime has already been logged and only requires you to formally press charges. This is done simply by contacting law enforcement via mobiglass, ship communications or going to a local justice department kiosk (where you currently pay fines at). From there is a box has "file complaint", which takes you to a place where active complaints can be selected. You can select an active complaint and it takes you to another page where you can "file complaint" or "Dismiss" (it could be on the other screen too) Once dismissed, you can't re-file. The ability to file a complaint has a limited time-span depending on the severity of the crime. Some might only have a 10-20 minute window, others might have a 3-4 hour window. These windows will run in real time, no matter if you are online or not. If you file the complaint, the person gets a crime-stat of the appropriate level. This even applies to offline players. At this time, it may or may not show the name of the person who performed the action, merely the time. This prevents the name and shame mechanic. - This will allow orgs to train PvP combat without necessarily generating a lot of crime stats, while still allowing people to generate a crime stat against those who are performing criminal actions against them.

2b) If an action occurs in un-monitored space, you and your ship need to survive the attack to file the complaint yourself. If you don't survive, the "black box" will wait 20-40 minutes (random), then generate a mission to retrieve it. If the mission is taken and is successful, a crime-stat goes out against the perps. A counter mission to destroy the black box also becomes available to the person(s) who committed the potential crimes. If the counter mission is successful, no crime stat will be generated. Again, the people who retrieve the black box will not know the name of the person who committed the original crime. If the action is not a crime in the space in which it occurred, no crime-stats will be given. - 2a and 2b are not the same as putting out a bounty on someone, which will be a separate mechanic

3) players who actively scan and detect that a ship is carrying illicit goods in that system can contact law enforcement via the communications system and upload the data when they are back in monitored space. If in un-monitored space, they will need to return to monitored space. Note, if the goods are not illegal in the jurisdiction the scan took place, no enforcement action can occur. This scan will not remove the cargo from the other players ship. If you scan a ship with legal goods, you might be able to sell that to a pirate syndicate that you have good standing with. - Note, item 3 and sub-bullets will need additional trade mechanics

3a) People being scanned will be notified that a scan is taking place. They need to figure out who is scanning them.

3b) The scan must be transmitted in full before enforcement actions can take place. This should take time (1-3 minutes?) where the scanned player can try to stop the transmission

3c) the scan data can be sold one time to other parties - either law-enforcement, a crime syndicate who might be interested in competition, or another player. Scan data may not be resold a second time by the original scanner, or the person who buys it.
3ci) law enforcement (or competing cartel) will buy the data for a cargo one time (if two people scan the same person on the same run, only the first to report it will get paid for the information) The amount of illicit goods determines the value of the data..so a scan of a Cat full of WiDoW is worth a lot more than a Cat with 1 SCU of WiDoW, which is worth more than a Cat with 1 Unit of WiDoW (value might be 1/2 to 1 percent of the value of the illicit goods) - EDIT - QUESTION - Should, the reward is only paid upon successful interdiction and capture of the smuggler or trader?
3cii) the smuggler can buy the data from the scanner at an agreed upon price. In this instance, a second scan by the original player will not be able to be sold to law enforcement (no double dipping), but another player could get a scan and sell it themselves.
 
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maynard

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I disagree with having to file a complaint in monitored space. The whole idea of monitored space is that everything you do is accessible by law enforcement, having to file a complaint would be redundant
 

Thalstan

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Thalstan
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I disagree with having to file a complaint in monitored space. The whole idea of monitored space is that everything you do is accessible by law enforcement, having to file a complaint would be redundant
The idea of needing to file the complaint is for people like TEST who want to do a little PvP training and not get crime stats for it. Also, so if you and a partner crash onto a planet, the pilot does not necessarily get a crime stat for accidentally killing his crew. But if they wanted to, they could file if they thought s/he did it on purpose.
 

maynard

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May 20, 2014
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The idea of needing to file the complaint is for people like TEST who want to do a little PvP training and not get crime stats for it. Also, so if you and a partner crash onto a planet, the pilot does not necessarily get a crime stat for accidentally killing his crew. But if they wanted to, they could file if they thought s/he did it on purpose.
you have certainly given this a lot of thought

I just want griefers to face immediate, harsh consequences for their actions

not sure how to distinguish griefing from legit gameplay though
 
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Zookajoe

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The idea of needing to file the complaint is for people like TEST who want to do a little PvP training and not get crime stats for it. Also, so if you and a partner crash onto a planet, the pilot does not necessarily get a crime stat for accidentally killing his crew. But if they wanted to, they could file if they thought s/he did it on purpose.
Well, they don't have a law against Manslaughter, Homicide is the closest they get. Manslaughter is criminal negligence that leads to the death of a person or persons, and is considered a felony. Thus, prison time.

As for PVP training, not sure how you would do that until they put out non lethal rounds. Or just do it in a Non-Monitored area in the Pyro system.

As neither the Pyro system, nor the prison system is in game, we are basically flogging an expired equine on this.
 

Grimbli

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Jan 27, 2016
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The whole idea of monitored space is that everything you do is accessible by law enforcement, having to file a complaint would be redundant
The idea of needing to file the complaint is for people like TEST who want to do a little PvP training and not get crime stats for it.
I just want griefers to face immediate, harsh consequences for their actions
I would suggest that those actions are immediately reported unless the people are in a group together.
 

invalidData

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Jan 18, 2020
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I think it's a good idea and you should post it on spectrum.
I think CIG is planing most of this or simillar already.
However I got vew things I would change, but it's up to you since this is your idea:

First of all with the criminal system don't only think of it as crimestats we got the fines now that you have to pay.
I think this should be the basis now and crimestats are a result of high fines or some crimes trigger crimestat as well.

2) 2a) I don't think you should can get away in monitored space with stuff. I mean beat someone up in front of a cop in real life expect him to wait until he get a complaint, that's not how it works.
As for party or party vs party or org fun they should do a system where you can disable certain crimes as long as you do them inside of those groups.
But I would let the jurisdiction have a word in accepting those rules. You want a pvp deathmatch in ArcCorp Placa? No way we gona let this happen, you can do it in the Expo Center where we can give you a Hologramm of it.
Try to explain to a cop that it's ok that you went far above the speed limit because you do a race with your friend...

2b) They plan that but you have to sell or hand in the black box before the offender gets charged. I think it's a good idea to create a delayed mission. If the offender is smart enough they destroys the black box on their own, maybe don't give them a mission to destroy the black box only the signal it sends out or at least don't pay them money if they succed their mission.
It also will depend to whom you sell the black box. Do you sell it Hurston, the UEE, some Criminals, the bounty hunter association or a Player Organisation? So you should be able to read out the black box if you got the equipment.

3) I think you should be able to sell scanner data to whoever you want to. The price will vary depending on how fresh the data is, if there is simillar data avalible, to whom you want to sell it. You should definetly get the money on the spot, not when this and that happens. Maybe get an extra reward when they get them. Maybe someone like the UEE has a price list for data from criminals, maybe you have to negotiate. As in real life it's very easy to copypaste data so you should be able to sell it as often as you want, maybe you get more money if you sell it exclusively, but how can you prove that you don't have more copies or sold it already?

Selling and buying Data will be big business and it's own gameloop, so you can't restrict it to one purchase transaction. Imagine this:
You are out exploring a System with your Carrack and stumble upon a really big and rich ore deposite.
Now you could either keep exploring on the risk someone else dicovers it or you could go and find the best bidder in all the Systems, both options are not great because you want to keep exploring and get a reward for your finding, sa you need other options that only come with the ability to resell. If you want to give it to your org that's good as well if the org can handle the deposite. Test could...
If you got a buddy that does regular supply runs for you, you can give them the data and carry on.
Maybe there are freelance data runners with a Herald in exploration zones, or you sell it at the nearest space station.
Anyway you want to sell as long as it's fresh and if you don't care who gets the data in the end those are good options so you can keep exploring.
Say you sell it to the nearest space station, since data is phsical in Star Citizen, they sell it to the next freighter that is capable in Data handlig, possibly to a Herald.
This one brings it to a more habitated area and sells it to the mining market.

Someone will want to claim the Ore deposite for their mining operations so somewhere some officials have to get access to the data so that they can allow the purchase of the deposite and set up the conditions.

If you are not in an Org and you find a Bengal Carrier, game is on. Better decide quickly to whom you sell this data and be sure this area will be a war zone soon.
 

SkywiseFahr

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Feb 5, 2020
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I like that 'black box' idea. That adds a whole new set of missions to SC.

The player scanning/reporting is also cool to think about. I wonder if a bit of risk should be added to the scanners side. Like the crime report shows the individual that did the scan, that way the snitches have the potential to get stitches.
 
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Cugino83

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Apr 25, 2019
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well I think the drawback is that while you can scan a ship, that one can scan you back... so better have a clean record if you ae going to play the law enforcer game.
Also, knowing the data of the person that is scanning you, even fi you are a criminal can be usefull: a good lawenforcer can get a criminal-bounty on his head if he mess up with the wrong crime organization.
 
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FZD

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Nov 22, 2016
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Eh, the player needs to get a crimestat the moment they attack, otherwise any bounty hunter or AI ship who happens by can't take immediate action. Or maybe even people responding to your beacons. Actually, some trolls could just hit you right outside of some supposedly secure trading hub, if they don't incur a crimestat until afterwards, it doesn't matter if they do their crimes right next to the full UEE fleet. They'll be long gone while you're still clicking away at that complaint.

As for friendly PvP, I think that's a whole separate thing. I think / hope they'll integrate arena commander / AC-like mechanisms in persistent universe at some point in such a way that allows people to have 'virtual' sessions, without risking their ships, characters life (permadeath is rare but supposedly a thing), incurring crimestat for PvP or getting interrupted by other players.

Not to mention that I kinda dislike the idea of excessive bureaucracy.
 
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