So I think I just had a great Idea for criminal gameplay in 3.9!

Daddy Chungus

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Jan 13, 2020
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Seeing how comm-arrays are going to be super important for criminals to be able to do missions and be sinister devils without detrimental effects I was thinking, what if instead of disabling 1 comm array to be able to grind a bunch of missions and hunt other players in a specific area, what if we took down all the comm arrays in a system and made the whole damn thing our domain.

It would mean we would be able to freely do our criminal ai missions in the system (like crusader **which would be best since we can hack down our crime stats in SPK**) that have been boosted by 50% so we can make bank without being charged any criminal violations so no criminal times (or little to none). We could also assume other players would be coming to re-take the comm arrays. Instead of stationing men around or inside them (which we could do if we really wanted), we could have people run patrols to see if any of the comm arrays have been tampered with. If anyone of the coom arrays get back capped it wouldn't be a huge deal because we could simply retake it and we would still have several other comm arrays. The risk would be that the force going to retake it would be in a lawful zone so if they were to get killed or kill themselves they would get sent to jail (and oh yeah another thing, you can kill yourself in a lawless zone if you think you’re going to lose a battle against a bounty hunter and spawn safely wherever you set your spawn at **assuming there are no ai security in close vicinity** It finally gives the eject button utility and is not a *bitch* way to go about things since good guys can spawn as much as they want safely while criminals are at a much higher risk of getting jailed. The drawback would be that it would take the criminal a bit to get back to the fight which would give the good guys some time to re-take a comm array or whatever else).



This could also turn into a battle either between a somewhat large criminal group and the good guys in the server or a somewhat large-large group of good guys. It'd be a battle of attacking and defending comm arrays. The good guys would have the advantage because they can spawn more frequently at no risk and nearby (which in my opinion is *kinda* fair because criminals aren’t supposed to have it easy). As the good guys take over more comm arrays the criminals would have less area to safely fight and die within and they would have to consider attempting to retake comm arrays, but that would be a huge risk to their soldiers. It would end with the criminals being pushed back entirely to one comm array area or being jailed entirely. The criminals could also potentially retake all the comm arrays and push the good guys out of their system.

**Instead of closing down Port Olisar/Grimhex/SPK we would be closing down an entire system and that sounds awesome to me**



One last thing I realized: You only need 1 person to take down a comm array which is by default going to give you a 2 crime stat. There can be people defending them from a safe distance. They could hack away their crime stat right after the comm array as well. I mentioned before that you could eject or kill yourself before bing killed by ai or a player to avoid being jailed, but I was off. You won't have a crime stat, to begin with, and wouldn't get one from killing in a lawless zone so you'd never be jailed.

Quick Recap: Essentially all your doing is capturing all comm arrays in a system to make the system a lawless one. All crime in that system would go unpunished until a force of good guys decides to fight back against them. The criminals don't have to worry about being sent to jail as long as they kill in areas covered by captured comm-arrays. The good guys can retake the system by taking all the comm arrays and/or sending all the criminals to jail.

If you'd like to upvote my citizen spotlight 🙂

If anyone would like to pop in for a read I've been managing a forum discussion about the criminal gameplay loop all day https://robertsspaceindustries.com/spectrum/community/SC/forum/3/thread/so-i-think-i-just-had-a-great-idea-for-criminal-ga
 
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Grimbli

Space Marshal
Jan 27, 2016
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Hilarious! I would be down for it. Would be funny to get a large group (or one per Array) to station at it with a Hammerhead and couple fighters to fend off people reactivating. This could be people who aren't necessarily criminals, but just love to pvp. Could have a few discord channels going with people at Arrays or on certain missions.

Although with the manpower required you'd almost need a full server to do this, so theres no reason to even guard them...
 

Daddy Chungus

Commander
Jan 13, 2020
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Daddy_Chungus
Hilarious! I would be down for it. Would be funny to get a large group (or one per Array) to station at it with a Hammerhead and couple fighters to fend off people reactivating. This could be people who aren't necessarily criminals, but just love to pvp. Could have a few discord channels going with people at Arrays or on certain missions.

Although with the manpower required you'd almost need a full server to do this, so theres no reason to even guard them...
Thank you for the positive reply! My goal was to reassure the criminals who are sad about the prison concept really slowing down their fun in the game and to show them that there is a gameplay loop that can counter it. Plus it's fun! The goal wasn't really to make it some kind of big event, I can see a small force efficiently (simultaneously) taking over all or most of the arrays in a system to make it lawless so they can do their missions and kill occasionally without being punished whatsoever. Also, guards wouldn't be necessary (but would help) instead you could have a small group patrol every once in a while to check on the arrays. The update certainly makes it more difficult to be a criminal, but I think it can also just make the gameplay much more fun!
 
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Lorddarthvik

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Feb 22, 2016
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In like the idea, sounds neat, but:
- don't all the planet's have their own monitored space regardless if the sats are up or not, and as lots of illegal.missions send you to these planets, wouldn't it be a problem still?
- illegal cargo running missions have the randomly generated police checks that will get you tagged regardless of sat status I think? So again, much work for not much gain if you get a lot of crime rating for running drugs and shit.
- basically what I'm trying to say is that Ai security will ruin your fun sadly

As I said, I like the idea, but I don't the think the game is there yet for it to work as you'd want it to.
I'd like to see it tried though lol
 

AntiSqueaker

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Apr 23, 2014
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Unfortunately a lot of the criminal missions right now aren't really worth the risk you take. Much easier, safer, and lucrative just to run cargo or do box missions.


An easy fix would be to allow you to sell stolen ships and cargo (at reduced %, since it's the black market and all) at the breaker yards or GrimHex with "no questions asked" terminals. It's honestly kind of silly you can't do that now. Are criminals suddenly too good to take a fully loaded Freelancer and scrap it for parts?

Getting a bounty on your head, imo right now makes is far too easy on the bounty hunter. You have a literal floating marker over your head with pinpoint accuracy, making it a no-brainer to track a ship down or to basically have a wallhack if you're stalking them through a CommArray. I think eventually it should be like a mission marker: you get a general idea of their location but manually have to track them down.

Hacking arrays is also kind of a PITA because you need to shell out 5000 aUEC per key, which eats into the efficiency of missions even more. And you aren't even guaranteed to get it because everyone flocks to the missions for the easy money.
A neat workaround for now would be to let "hacking ships" like the Herald and (eventually) Mercury remotely hack CommArrays. Letting one person scrub multiple people of their CrimeStat at the same time would be a nice bonus.

I'm absolutely fine with having criminal enterprises be risky, but the rewards have to match the risk. Right now, they really are not.
 
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Daddy Chungus

Commander
Jan 13, 2020
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Daddy_Chungus
Unfortunately a lot of the criminal missions right now aren't really worth the risk you take. Much easier, safer, and lucrative just to run cargo or do box missions.


An easy fix would be to allow you to sell stolen ships and cargo (at reduced %, since it's the black market and all) at the breaker yards or GrimHex with "no questions asked" terminals. It's honestly kind of silly you can't do that now. Are criminals suddenly too good to take a fully loaded Freelancer and scrap it for parts?

Getting a bounty on your head, imo right now makes is far too easy on the bounty hunter. You have a literal floating marker over your head with pinpoint accuracy, making it a no-brainer to track a ship down or to basically have a wallhack if you're stalking them through a CommArray. I think eventually it should be like a mission marker: you get a general idea of their location but manually have to track them down.

Hacking arrays is also kind of a PITA because you need to shell out 5000 aUEC per key, which eats into the efficiency of missions even more. And you aren't even guaranteed to get it because everyone flocks to the missions for the easy money.
A neat workaround for now would be to let "hacking ships" like the Herald and (eventually) Mercury remotely hack CommArrays. Letting one person scrub multiple people of their CrimeStat at the same time would be a nice bonus.

I'm absolutely fine with having criminal enterprises be risky, but the rewards have to match the risk. Right now, they really are not.
Everything you said was really on point! I haven't even played in 3.9 yet tbh, but I can already feel that there will be issues, as you said, with making profits as a criminal. Your idea about the herald was also brilliant. I'd love to see that asap if it were possible. Just to argue though, even though you have a marker on your head for getting a bounty trying to hack a comm array you'd rely on your mate to protect you while those bounty hunters pop in to try and kill the hacker. Also the concept you explained where the general area is labeled but there is no perfect marker above a criminal's head is actually in-game, but only functions, when a criminal is in a lawless zone, (downed comm-array, or Levski strangely). Plus you wouldn't have to worry about bounty hunters flocking after you if you hack away that 2 crime stat ASAP after the comm-array hack. It'd take commitment on the good guy's side if they want to actually retaliate.
 
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