Neat fleet building tool (And my Idris crippling Strike Package)

[Han Burgundy]

Saw this neat little tool on Reddit and I figured I'd drop it here too. http://fubank.org/ships.aspx# was made by a gentleperson by the name of Jo3blank. Its fun to play around with. I was messing around building different strike packages and whatnot and discovered that I had been at it for an hour and a half.

Well, anyways; Here's my boom and zoom type package for disabling an Idris for the purpose of reducing risk for a larger force that will be coming in after to attempt a boarding.

Wave 1: Scouting

Terrapin will be the first to sniff out the enemy and report their location
​

Wave 2: Stealth Strike

The opening volley will be a series of torpedoes from the Sabre-escorted Eclipse bombers. To better match the superior stealth of the bombers in their charge, the Sabres are to keep their shields inactive until contact is made. The main focus of the strike is survivability, which relies on the principals of a hit and run.
​

Wave 3: Knockout blow

The main force of this strike group would be headed up by two bomber groups consisting of a Vanguard Sentinel, Retaliator bomber, and three SuperHornet escorts each. This wave would be spearheaded by the Sentinels and their E-war ability (Whatever form that may take) to ensure the shields are as weak as possible for the bombers to follow. Retaliators are close behind and release their payload to ensure the shields have collapsed completely and may even inflict some initial damage to the armor plating by the time the Polaris is sending its impressive ordinance to finish the crippling blow. If the Polaris is basically awarded a completely undefended sucker-punch, I imagine it could at the very least disable some engine systems or crack open a few decks; something to keep it pinned in place for the friendlies coming in on their heels to board.
​

Anyhoo, that was my descent into madness this evening. I can't wait to try stuff like that for real....someday....



What packages/scenarios can you come up with?

 

[Blind Owl]

You want me to fucking think??? But I'm beering!

Edit: too tired and drunk to work this complex thingy right now. Tomorrow methinks.

 

[felyxsnow]

Ooooh this is nice. Bookmarked! good find

 

[Beerjerker]

What a fun little doo-flunky!
Just to try it out, made adjustments to your plan, @Han Burgundy . Take or leave suggestions as you like, of course, but I had fun tweaking it.

Wave 1 - Eyeballs: Added a second Terrapin for redundancy and to cover greater area in finding targets. Once targets identified, they can turtle up stealth wise, one watching the prey, one watching a flank.

Wave 2 - Suckerpunch: Eclipses and Sabres roll sneaky in as you suggest, hit and run. But added a couple Ghosts to serve as escorts to cover the retreat of the Eclipses, while the Sabres stay in play to either render cover to the Terrapins if they are discovered, or to skirmish enemy fighters and draw them out of position.

Wave 3 - Feint: Single Sentinel enters from an unexpected angle to scramble sensors, launch decoys, whatever it can to cover the escape of the Eclipses and distract from the entrance of the big honkin' boats.
(This could even come in as part of, or before Wave 2. Could even keep a second Sentinel in reserve for Wave 4 to use decoys to make the attack appear larger than it is, or to obfuscate a retreat if everything goes horribly wrong. Still, the Sentinel Feint would act independently enough from the other waves that I wouldn't lock them into either. Just an afterthought.)

Wave 4 - Haymaker: Polaris and Retaliator enter for the killing blow on the main target or targets. Dropped one Retaliator, just because I figured I was adding personnel in other places, and that's still a whole bunch of bombs.
The Super Hornets (this could be a mix of fighters, even some Gladiators for moar bombs!) act as escort to the bigger boats before they enter, but once Wave 4 begins, they would coordinate with the Sabres and the Ghosts (provided the Eclipses got out and vanished back into hiding) to establish fighter dominance on the field. At this point, the Terrapins would pop out of shadows to keep active watch for enemy reinforcements.

Also, because if something can go wrong, it will, added a Cutlass Black and Red for support. The Red, obviously, as search and rescue. I expect the Polaris will have some medical facilities too, but the Red will be faster at getting ejected pilots off the field so the whole fleet doesn't linger after the battle and can get back to sneaking around and blowing stuff up.
The Black would loot the wreckage, take prisoners, and contribute to Hornet area control. But it's main role would be as a runner back and forth to friendly territory or support allies for resupply. Maybe not torpedoes if they are too big to carry, but smaller missiles and ammunition, also to ferry ejected pilots to get new ships to reinforce. Whatever is needed to avoid taking the whole fleet out of action until all of the primary ordinance is spent.
Other cargo capable ships could be put in this role, perhaps Redeemer or Freelancer, but I went with the Cutlass to keep the fleet as mobile as possible and to avoid requiring more and more escorts or personnel.

Hope you enjoyed my theorycraftology! Thanks for spotting this gem @Han Burgundy !

Edit: Thinking back on this plan, I would add a command and control ship, who kept an overview and managed communications, but didn't have an active fighting role in the attack. The attack plan has moving parts and depends on timing to work its best, and that needs a conductor to make the music happen.
The most benefit is that everybody wouldn't be in the same voice channel, talking all at once about different things, but one would keep track of all the channels. At first, I thought commands would come from the Polaris, and maybe it still could, but the Polaris operation should have its own channel and would be very busy in the fight.
Maybe a Hornet Tracker lending extra scans as needed. Maybe a Redeemer lending extra guns. Maybe a Constellation lending extra resupply. But it should only be lending these in emergencies or in transit to the next attack. Whatever the boat (whatever is skipper's preference really), I'd definitely think a separate command element would make this much more effective.

 

[Printimus]

neato burrito!

 

[Printimus]

I hate your app thingy! :(
all my ships are too big and dont fit in the window. Its stupid and i hate it!

(commence temper tantrum/pouty phase)

 

[Shadow Reaper]

I'm not sure why I am not getting an image I can post or even DL.

IMHO, the real trick to designing fleet engagements is to not use more assets for any one task than are necessary. You want to build in reserves in case something goes wrong, but your reserves can't be particularly large or there is too much invested in the assault. Whether you are pirating, privateering or fighting for your flag, you only get just so much resource. Anyone who has studied combat knows you want to always attack with overwhelming force, so the key is to attack when an opponent cannot bring their force to bear. This is near impossible with NPC targets that never sleep.

So just saying, using minimalist attack force goes into my thinking, as does use of stealth, diversion, distraction, draw plays that separate enemy forces, etc. For an attack on an Idris I would want:

4 Ghost Trackers, each loaded with 2 BEHR Ballistic Cannons, which gives good range so they can attack from relative stealth and most fighters will not be able to see them. These are scouts and can be flown in pairs with just one PC in charge of each pair--2 players total.

3 Eclipse, each armed with 3 Arrester type shock torps. These should each launch 2 shock torps and stay on station with their remaining torps in case reinforcements arrive before the Idris is boarded. If engaged by fighter escorts the Hornets will defend them, only until the Prowlers have landed their boarding troops. Then they will leave. If the Eclipse can load a pair of S3 Arresters instead of their third S9 torp, this would be optimal. 3 players total.

2 Prowlers, each carrying 4 BEHR Ballistic Cannons, 2 BEHR M7A lasers, 1 pilot and 2 Master Sargents, each in command of 7 NPC marines. 6 players total.

All 9 ships require 11 players minimum to attack an Idris. Personally I would not use such a minimalist force until I know the techniques worked, but would add at least one of each ship in the three classes until I know this was a successful method. That is 5 more players for a total of 16, which is an unwieldy size for most gameplay.

The goal is to land 32 attackers from 4 entry points and take the ship from within. I would not want to attack a target like this with Vanguard as the casualties would be very high. Stealth is definitely the way to take an Idris, IMHO.

The Scouts need to create a diversion to draw off the fighter escorts (that others seemed to have neglected), and the Eclipse can then attack from three directions at once, dropping the shields all the way around the Idris and knocking out its computer with just 2 torps each.

The Hornets need to draw the Idris' escort fighters away so they cannot attack the Prowlers when they are close and vulnerable. This is easy--they just attack an escort fighter, flee, and hide. The Eclipse and Prowlers then all make direct attack runs at once, and the arresters land on shield and ship mere seconds before the Prowlers arrive and disembark their troops. Once the troops are landed all of the attacking ships can leave. My guess is the Idris' escorts are not going to fire on the Idris once it falls into enemy hands. I could be wrong here. Looks like we will have to find out!

 

[Han Burgundy]

What a fun little doo-flunky!
Just to try it out, made adjustments to your plan, @Han Burgundy . Take or leave suggestions as you like, of course, but I had fun tweaking it.

View attachment 6515

Wave 1 - Eyeballs: Added a second Terrapin for redundancy and to cover greater area in finding targets. Once targets identified, they can turtle up stealth wise, one watching the prey, one watching a flank.

Wave 2 - Suckerpunch: Eclipses and Sabres roll sneaky in as you suggest, hit and run. But added a couple Ghosts to serve as escorts to cover the retreat of the Eclipses, while the Sabres stay in play to either render cover to the Terrapins if they are discovered, or to skirmish enemy fighters and draw them out of position.

Wave 3 - Feint: Single Sentinel enters from an unexpected angle to scramble sensors, launch decoys, whatever it can to cover the escape of the Eclipses and distract from the entrance of the big honkin' boats.
(This could even come in as part of, or before Wave 2. Could even keep a second Sentinel in reserve for Wave 4 to use decoys to make the attack appear larger than it is, or to obfuscate a retreat if everything goes horribly wrong. Still, the Sentinel Feint would act independently enough from the other waves that I wouldn't lock them into either. Just an afterthought.)

Wave 4 - Haymaker: Polaris and Retaliator enter for the killing blow on the main target or targets. Dropped one Retaliator, just because I figured I was adding personnel in other places, and that's still a whole bunch of bombs.
The Super Hornets (this could be a mix of fighters, even some Gladiators for moar bombs!) act as escort to the bigger boats before they enter, but once Wave 4 begins, they would coordinate with the Sabres and the Ghosts (provided the Eclipses got out and vanished back into hiding) to establish fighter dominance on the field. At this point, the Terrapins would pop out of shadows to keep active watch for enemy reinforcements.

Also, because if something can go wrong, it will, added a Cutlass Black and Red for support. The Red, obviously, as search and rescue. I expect the Polaris will have some medical facilities too, but the Red will be faster at getting ejected pilots off the field so the whole fleet doesn't linger after the battle and can get back to sneaking around and blowing stuff up.
The Black would loot the wreckage, take prisoners, and contribute to Hornet area control. But it's main role would be as a runner back and forth to friendly territory or support allies for resupply. Maybe not torpedoes if they are too big to carry, but smaller missiles and ammunition, also to ferry ejected pilots to get new ships to reinforce. Whatever is needed to avoid taking the whole fleet out of action until all of the primary ordinance is spent.
Other cargo capable ships could be put in this role, perhaps Redeemer or Freelancer, but I went with the Cutlass to keep the fleet as mobile as possible and to avoid requiring more and more escorts or personnel.

Hope you enjoyed my theorycraftology! Thanks for spotting this gem @Han Burgundy !

Edit: Thinking back on this plan, I would add a command and control ship, who kept an overview and managed communications, but didn't have an active fighting role in the attack. The attack plan has moving parts and depends on timing to work its best, and that needs a conductor to make the music happen.
The most benefit is that everybody wouldn't be in the same voice channel, talking all at once about different things, but one would keep track of all the channels. At first, I thought commands would come from the Polaris, and maybe it still could, but the Polaris operation should have its own channel and would be very busy in the fight.
Maybe a Hornet Tracker lending extra scans as needed. Maybe a Redeemer lending extra guns. Maybe a Constellation lending extra resupply. But it should only be lending these in emergencies or in transit to the next attack. Whatever the boat (whatever is skipper's preference really), I'd definitely think a separate command element would make this much more effective.

Excellent alternate plan! I also felt the need for a Hornet Tracker after looking at my own lineup. I think I shall design a ground assault force now. Gotta think of all the fun ways to use those Eclipses with some Prowlers. FUN! Ooh ooh or a Mining fleet! OR an exploration fleet! Guys, I think I know what I'm going to do to kill time between now and 3.0 (I'm easily entertained)

 

[Han Burgundy]

Okay, so the scenario I built in my noggin for this one is a ground assault on a small to mid-sized enemy outpost. This attack assumes the enemy has Anti-Air defenses and minimal air support.

Wave 1:

Prowler comes in first, undetected, to deploy a forward observation team. Their job will be to get a good vantage point of the enemy facility and feed that intel back to command via the prowler (If it's too dangerous to transmit, the prowler can sneak back out and deliver the initial strike intel the old fashioned way)
​

Wave 2:

Forward observers prioritize targets and paint the enemy defenses for a stealth strike from the Eclipses. As the stealth bombers drop their payload, the Hornet Tracker drifts over ahead of wave 3 @ high altitude to establish battlefield awareness and sync the fleet with the real-time targeting data that the ground team is providing.
​

Wave 3:

The Hoplites and their Hornet escorts are then preceded into battle by the Gladiators that will fly ahead and mop up any remaining air defenses still being painted by the observers. The hornets can then provide Air to air and Air to ground support as the Hoplites land near the base and start deploying their troops. (Cant the hoplites carry a rover?)
​

From that point, it would be up to the guys on the ground to kick sufficient ass. In the end, this could be a horrible plan based on how mechanics turn out. The point of theorycrafting, however, is the fact that NOBODY knows for sure how gameplay will end up feeling; so we wing it. Fun stuff!

 

[Printimus]

Where's the Aurora Sun Blotting fleet?

 

[AntiSqueaker]

Piracy Fleet, assuming attack a roughly equal sized (hopefully unaware) force of cargo ships and escorts.

Wave 1: Eclipse as a stealthy scout to just make sure we aren't getting ganked. Sabres following a bit behind just in case the Eclipse gets jumped. Eclipse will launch torpedoes if it has an opportunity to, or wait around until an opportunity presents itself, then scrams.

Wave 2: Tracker to double check we have an eye on everyone we want to keep an eye on.

Wave 3: 2 Buccaneers to, along with the Sabres, engage and tie down enemy fighters while Wave 4 moves in.

Wave 4: 2 Cutlass Blacks (or preferably Blues with the cargo hold) depending on situation will either engage enemy fighters or start to cripple enemy transports. Boarding as necessary.

Wave 5: Caterpillar comes in for support and secondary boarding platform. EDIT: Should mention that the Cat can carry some Dragonflies as well (maybe with Distortion cannons to disable cargo ships?) but that seems like such a suicide mission I wouldn't wish it upon anyone.

If everything goes according to plan then the crews of the Cutlasses and Caterpillar quickly load up the cargo. Sabres depart first to clear the way, followed by the Cutlasses and Caterpillar. Buccaneers are the rear guard.

 

[Han Burgundy]

Okay, last one. I promise. I have a problem, I know. THIS is my "Smallest I'd want to go" big-rig mining operation fleet. This is for if you find a nice source of good ore and would like to strip it without breaking the bank.

Terrapins are sitting quietly a ways out from the rest of the fleet to keep an eye out for approaching enemies.

Hornet Tracker will circle around near the fleet so it can relay the Terrapin's info to everyone else

The 3 Sabres + Connie will be my reactionary wing that will sprint out toward any detected enemy to project an immediate show of force. If good ole posturing won't do the trick, those ships should be reasonably capable of stalling an enemy's advance. This is their main purpose; Buy time for the rest of the fleet to scoot outta there.

2 Prospectors will fart around looking for the next good ore vein that the Orion can tear into.

The 2 Cats and their accompanying Defenders will take turns ferrying the ore back to base

Starfarer keeps everyone hydrated, and the hornets are tasked with providing cover to it and the Orion.


I probably missed something, but dying horribly in the vacuum of space is all part of learning, right?

 

[Beerjerker]

I hate your app thingy! :(
all my ships are too big and dont fit in the window. Its stupid and i hate it!

(commence temper tantrum/pouty phase)

The slider labeled "output resolution" adjusts the size of the window. But you still have to finish your vegetables!

I'm not sure why I am not getting an image I can post or even DL.

When it generates an image, it will eventually show you a little thumbnail. Right click and save the thumbnail, it is actually a higher resolution png.

 

[Printimus]

The slider labeled "output resolution" adjusts the size of the window. But you still have to finish your vegetables!

Oh.....well now i feel stupid.

 

[AntiSqueaker]

Okay, last one. I promise. I have a problem, I know. THIS is my "Smallest I'd want to go" big-rig mining operation fleet. This is for if you find a nice source of good ore and would like to strip it without breaking the bank.

Jesus, do we have differing opinions on what "smallest" means. Paying 13 fighter jockeys, 2 Terrapin crews, a Connie crew, 2 Cats crews, and a Starfarer is going to gouge your profit margin into oblivion. Even if you're not paying them up front and doing a profit-share that's still almost 40 players/NPCs that aren't mining stuff for a mining op.

If this is in nulsec then yeah you might need a big crew like this- but in safe(r) UEE space I reckon you could probably get away with a wing of Hornets as escort and be all right.

 

[Han Burgundy]

Jesus, do we have differing opinions on what "smallest" means. Paying 13 fighter jockeys, 2 Terrapin crews, a Connie crew, 2 Cats crews, and a Starfarer is going to gouge your profit margin into oblivion. Even if you're not paying them up front and doing a profit-share that's still almost 40 players/NPCs that aren't mining stuff for a mining op.

If this is in nulsec then yeah you might need a big crew like this- but in safe(r) UEE space I reckon you could probably get away with a wing of Hornets as escort and be all right.

Well said! This is absolutely intended for Null sec space with the idea that it is a highly valuable, yet undiscovered/non-claimed extraction site (AKA a price per kilo that would justify the operation costs). Take TOO big of a force in, and your op will light up like the fourth of july with all the traffic headed in and out. This would be more for mining under another group's nose or in their controlled space.

Would I mine for Iron like this? Aww hell no. But if I find a moon-sized hunk of unobtanium (or whatever), its worth trying to sneak some away. Then again, I'm just some asshole on the internet throwing out a bit of theorycrafting.

 

[Beerjerker]

Reading about all the AA draaawmuh, I came up with this as a Bounty Hunter/White Knight trap.
I think I'll call it:
"Your Princess is in Another Castle"

Group 1 - the Lure
The Caterpillar is the worm on the hook. Whoever has the highest bounty will pilot and rumors will be circulated about some ne'er-do-well cruising the vicinity. Whatever modules make it more tanky or survivable, but in general, it would be meant to appear vulnerable. A Hornet Tracker would pose as a lone escort but really be there as a bobber to relay messages when some do-gooder takes the bait. A couple Hornet Ghosts will hang back incognito to provide a bit beefier stealth escort if required.

Group 2 - the Net
Led by a Sentinel sewing confusion, decoy, jamming, whatever, Cutlasses and Redeemers enter and skirmish. Also the Ghosts, if they were not yet revealed, would make themselves known and contribute to the fight. The fight would be meant to provide an opportunity for the Warlocks to pop EMPs and disable for the Cutlassed and Redeemers to begin boarding.

Group 3 - the Sinker
Prowler defended by Sabres sneak in and begin a second boarding from a flank, or reinforce Group 2's boarding action.

Group 4 - the Fish Fry
Reclaimer jumps in to munch up the fancy bounty hunter ships that have been destroyed. It will be escorted by Harbingers (other bombers and fighters would work too), but while the hungry hungry hippo eats and the commandeered ships are extracted, this bomber escort will mostly wait in ambush for butt hurt reinforcements.
Cutlass Red added to group for SAR as needed, and Freelancer (edit: or any cargo capable boat) as runner for resupply, and Terrapin to keep long range watch. Also, for added humiliation, dropped in a Herald to hack the enemy and steal their dank memes, upload malware into their spaceships, or be a general pest.
(Edit: While on clean up, if enough of the force is not too beat up to continue, Group 4 could combine with 1 and set up another Lure for enemy reinforcements. Wash, rinse, repeat until all their memes are belong to us!)

 

[Graf_Orlock]

Distract them with the pretty, clean up with the gritty

 

[hardroc77]

Saw this neat little tool on Reddit and I figured I'd drop it here too. http://fubank.org/ships.aspx# was made by a gentleperson by the name of Jo3blank. Its fun to play around with. I was messing around building different strike packages and whatnot and discovered that I had been at it for an hour and a half.

Well, anyways; Here's my boom and zoom type package for disabling an Idris for the purpose of reducing risk for a larger force that will be coming in after to attempt a boarding.

Wave 1: Scouting

Terrapin will be the first to sniff out the enemy and report their location
​

Wave 2: Stealth Strike

The opening volley will be a series of torpedoes from the Sabre-escorted Eclipse bombers. To better match the superior stealth of the bombers in their charge, the Sabres are to keep their shields inactive until contact is made. The main focus of the strike is survivability, which relies on the principals of a hit and run.
​

Wave 3: Knockout blow

The main force of this strike group would be headed up by two bomber groups consisting of a Vanguard Sentinel, Retaliator bomber, and three SuperHornet escorts each. This wave would be spearheaded by the Sentinels and their E-war ability (Whatever form that may take) to ensure the shields are as weak as possible for the bombers to follow. Retaliators are close behind and release their payload to ensure the shields have collapsed completely and may even inflict some initial damage to the armor plating by the time the Polaris is sending its impressive ordinance to finish the crippling blow. If the Polaris is basically awarded a completely undefended sucker-punch, I imagine it could at the very least disable some engine systems or crack open a few decks; something to keep it pinned in place for the friendlies coming in on their heels to board.
​

Anyhoo, that was my descent into madness this evening. I can't wait to try stuff like that for real....someday....



What packages/scenarios can you come up with?

But what wave are the Mosquitoes in/ You know the massive amount of Auroras and dragonflies to distract and piss off the victim(s).




Seriously, a great idea. I'll have to think about this more when I'm having my morning coffee and can think.
1:30 a.m.?????

 

[Han Burgundy]

But what wave are the Mosquitoes in/ You know the massive amount of Auroras and dragonflies to distract and piss off the victim(s).




Seriously, a great idea. I'll have to think about this more when I'm having my morning coffee and can think.
1:30 a.m.?????

The auroras come right after the initial attack. Basically all the initial attack is meant to do is immobilize the target so our shitty Well trained and certified aurora pilots can ram the damn thing without missing.