Invictus Launch week - Polaris not limited?

vahadar

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if you spawn it stays in game after logging out
Actually that is the case for ALL ships. As long as you have someone on board occupying a position on ship, if the ship is moving, and if the owner of the ship has logged, the ship will stay ingame.
And Idris will obey to this rule as any other ship. It will despawn if noone is on board. They clearly explained that in the Kraken Privateer Q&A.
There is a different rule for ships beyond the Javelin size, where they will stay effectively in game forever, even if no one on board. Namely the Bengal.
 

vahadar

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Figured most of the turrets would be either bladed or AI crew operated as their purpose is to keep fighters off you as well as hopefully shoot down incoming torpedoes/missiles. For me I have always viewed the Hammerhead as being a defensive large ship as the targets its after can easily outrun it but also cannot easily get past it to target other ships.
For players it will be a nice mission running ship. It obviously have high cost but I doubt most Polaris will be bladed.

edit : for our CFT training once released i bet it will be a first choice compared to both the Carrack (med bay, and boarding ops scenario) and the Hammerhead (our "pirate base" scenario, and boarding ops), in a single ship.
 
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Bambooza

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For players it will be a nice mission running ship. It obviously have high cost but I doubt most Polaris will be bladed.

edit : for our CFT training once released i bet it will be a first choice compared to both the Carrack (med bay, and boarding ops scenario) and the Hammerhead (our "pirate base" scenario, and boarding ops), in a single ship.

My only issue has always been what small ship should it carry.

But I agree its going to be a great mission running ship so long as you are not launching those S10 torpedoes at targets cause that's going to get costly quickly.
 

RedBaron1010

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My only issue has always been what small ship should it carry.

But I agree its going to be a great mission running ship so long as you are not launching those S10 torpedoes at targets cause that's going to get costly quickly.
The Terrapin would be a good choice. Send it out ahead to look for targets or find out enemy convoy compositions before you attack with your fleet.
 

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In WWII, the term "Destroyer" was invented to describe a new class of boat that was created specifically to destroy small torpedo boats and subs. These were originally called "Tin Cans" for they were much smaller, lighter and more agile than their cruiser cousins. These little Destroyers can be considered cap ships, but only because of their in-fleet function.

By this older definition, the HH is a Destroyer. It runs interference on fighters, bombers and anything else that wants to sneak up on a fleet and attack from close range. By contrast, the Perseus is actually in the patrol boat interdiction class, meant to intimidate with its big guns, any non-martial vessel into compliance. If the Perseus guys are doing it right, they never have to fire their guns at all.

The Polaris is another class than either of these, and for best results really should be considered a hunter of opponent cap class vessels, more like a submarine than anything else. Hence the name--harkens back to the first nuclear subs of the late 1950's, and the ballistic missiles they were able to launch (both "Polaris".). Earliest reveal on the Polaris was that it was created to combat Vanduul Void Bombers and that is its ideal purpose. Like the original Corvette, and the Perseus, you can bring them into fleet engagements, but they are not intended for this, and unless they're turning the tide of battle, you are throwing them away using them against big cap ships. Putting several Perseus against a Vanduul Marauder is basically throwing them away. Using a Polaris against any sort of cap class vessel is fine, given the elements of surprise and evasion one usually does not have in fleet engagements.
 

wmk

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My only issue has always been what small ship should it carry.

But I agree its going to be a great mission running ship so long as you are not launching those S10 torpedoes at targets cause that's going to get costly quickly.
I'm going to offer rearm and refuel services to recover some operating costs. Besides, it's multi-purpose ship; theoretically, you could use it even for cargo runs.

Assuming the hangar bay is 29m long and 21.5m wide (original/concept Polaris dimensions are 155m L x 81m W x 38m H), the list of ships that should fit is pretty long:
  • Drake Dragonfly,
  • Argo MPUV,
  • AopoA Khartu-al,
  • Origin M-50, Kruger P-X2 series,
  • Vanduul Blade,
  • Consolidated Outland Mustang series,
  • RSI Aurora series,
  • Aegis Avenger series,
  • Anvil Terrapin,
  • Aegis Gladius,
  • Drake Buccaneer,
  • MISC Hull A,
  • MISC Prospector,
  • Origin 300 series,
  • Anvil Hornet series,
  • MISC Reliant series,
  • Aegis Sabre
I highlighted those that would be very useful to carry with Polaris... -- imagine transporting Prospector to some mining field located in deep space, unreachable for that small mining ship...
That said, I really hope Polaris is going to grow a little bit, so we could load even larger spacecraft in it.

One day... one day...

1621712784580.jpg
 

Shadow Reaper

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I'm doubtful the way to think of the Polaris is it's able to carry a ship, as opposed to that it is able to refuel and refit any ship that fits in the hangar. It should be able to support many ships flying with it.

However, given the primary mission of hunting and killing enemy cap ships, the real need is going to be for a spotting ship that flies 20 km ahead and illuminates targets for the Polaris to launch on. For that I would consider both the Space Turtle, and the Razor EX with its wings cut off. The Razor is a good choice because it has such a very high drift velocity so can do passive searches of empty space faster than most other ships, regardless of radar array size. Cutting off the wings should make one able to fit quite a few into the Polaris hangar so they don't need to make long jumps on their own.
 

Talonsbane

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That's exactly how I think of them. The Idris and Jav are important to have in a large fleet and players need to know how to fly them as a group, but events needing them are going to be relatively sparse unless hundreds of players commit to fighting Vanduul over a protracted period of time. Either way though, players will be mining and salvaging etc., between martial engagements.

The Polaris is a ship a score of comrades can live on together. They're gonna hang by the pool table and sing sea shanties. It's a drunkard's ship, but that will make you sober up quick when she goes into action.

We don't yet know how effective S10 torps really will be and how easily they're evaded, spoofed, etc., but the fact that the Polaris does not need to line up for a shot with an S10 gun to score a kill is huge. She'll certainly need to use her speed to control range to target, and she'll need a spotter to keep contact at great range, but in general the torps should prove more effective than the big spinal mounts.
If I'm not mistaken, a while back some people & I were tinkering with the numbers to figure out how much each of the torps of the Polaris would cost. At that time, it was somewhere around 2 million UEC each. I'm pretty sure that was before CIG jumped the cost of missiles & torps though. Even so, with 24 torps, at that cost, you'd be looking at almost 50 million UEC just to fully restock those on a Polaris. Ouch!

I'm going to offer rearm and refuel services to recover some operating costs. Besides, it's multi-purpose ship; theoretically, you could use it even for cargo runs.

Assuming the hangar bay is 29m long and 21.5m wide (original/concept Polaris dimensions are 155m L x 81m W x 38m H), the list of ships that should fit is pretty long:
  • Drake Dragonfly,
  • Argo MPUV,
  • AopoA Khartu-al,
  • Origin M-50, Kruger P-X2 series,
  • Vanduul Blade,
  • Consolidated Outland Mustang series,
  • RSI Aurora series,
  • Aegis Avenger series,
  • Anvil Terrapin,
  • Aegis Gladius,
  • Drake Buccaneer,
  • MISC Hull A,
  • MISC Prospector,
  • Origin 300 series,
  • Anvil Hornet series,
  • MISC Reliant series,
  • Aegis Sabre
I highlighted those that would be very useful to carry with Polaris... -- imagine transporting Prospector to some mining field located in deep space, unreachable for that small mining ship...
That said, I really hope Polaris is going to grow a little bit, so we could load even larger spacecraft in it.

One day... one day...

View attachment 20774
Just a reminder that CIG recently confirmed that the Scorpius is designed to be able to fit inside a Polaris hangar, which means that the Vanguard line should as well.
 

Shadow Reaper

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Even so, with 24 torps, at that cost, you'd be looking at almost 50 million UEC just to fully restock those on a Polaris. Ouch!
Yeah, but the Polaris was invented to fly the Son's of Orion storyline killing Vanduul ships, and CIG controls the payout for those missions as well. They know if they won't pay for torps no one will fly them, so one expects the missions will pay quite well, or the torps will be provided by the mission leader. My guess is, finding ways to succeed at those missions without the cost of torps, is the way to get wealthy running missions, like using a Sentinel EMP and full Harby attack wing. The Void Bomber has a LOT of guns--three spinal mounts I think--but like all Vanduul ships it is built more for attack than defense. So it's pretty sensible that half dozen Harby's main guns could kill a Void Bomber pretty quickly once its computer(s) goes down.
 

Bambooza

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The Terrapin would be a good choice. Send it out ahead to look for targets or find out enemy convoy compositions before you attack with your fleet.
Don't get me wrong I love the Terrapin and I wish it was modular but it so far has only one purpose and as John said on Friday the 21st of May its intended as a single person ship. So I am not sure just having a small craft that can scout ahead of the Polaris with a smaller radar would be that effective. Now if the Terrapin was able to swap out the radar chair for a couple drop seats or a medical bed then it becomes a handy multi use craft that would greatly augment the Polaris. But as it stands limited radar scanning just doesn't seem to be that big of a benefit over other ships that go in the hanger.

I like the idea of the added firepower a combat ship like the new scorpius but I am not sure how it would help as if it was being swarmed by fighters then it would need to jump out asap. Would a few more guns really help? I know people like to think they will be able to support a wing of fighters but the issue comes down to jump times as fighters are limited in range as well as their jump speed is slower so it becomes a logistical nightmare for what purpose? Why not just bring a Kraken, or change the target/mission to one better suited for the Polaris?

So I have for the moment feel that a ship that can move cargo and personnel would be the most benefit allowing for an expanded role for the Polaris to explore a derelict or abandoned station and possibly retrieve items. Also allows it to resupply at stations that might not have docking facilities big enough for it.

Of course there is a point where it takes the ship to far off its intended role as a hunter sub and tries to fulfill the role of the Idris which has the hanger facilities to launch fighters/bombers support ships etc.
 

Talonsbane

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Don't get me wrong I love the Terrapin and I wish it was modular but it so far has only one purpose and as John said on Friday the 21st of May its intended as a single person ship. So I am not sure just having a small craft that can scout ahead of the Polaris with a smaller radar would be that effective. Now if the Terrapin was able to swap out the radar chair for a couple drop seats or a medical bed then it becomes a handy multi use craft that would greatly augment the Polaris. But as it stands limited radar scanning just doesn't seem to be that big of a benefit over other ships that go in the hanger.

I like the idea of the added firepower a combat ship like the new scorpius but I am not sure how it would help as if it was being swarmed by fighters then it would need to jump out asap. Would a few more guns really help? I know people like to think they will be able to support a wing of fighters but the issue comes down to jump times as fighters are limited in range as well as their jump speed is slower so it becomes a logistical nightmare for what purpose? Why not just bring a Kraken, or change the target/mission to one better suited for the Polaris?

So I have for the moment feel that a ship that can move cargo and personnel would be the most benefit allowing for an expanded role for the Polaris to explore a derelict or abandoned station and possibly retrieve items. Also allows it to resupply at stations that might not have docking facilities big enough for it.

Of course there is a point where it takes the ship to far off its intended role as a hunter sub and tries to fulfill the role of the Idris which has the hanger facilities to launch fighters/bombers support ships etc.
Odds are that the hangar of the Polaris might also be able to carry & launch an Eclipse. With it's stealth abilities & those S9 torps, it could be quite useful in a cap battle where the Polaris is involved.
 

Shadow Reaper

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Odds are that the hangar of the Polaris might also be able to carry & launch an Eclipse. With it's stealth abilities & those S9 torps, it could be quite useful in a cap battle where the Polaris is involved.
Depending if the Vulcan has a bed, head, galley and airlock (which it likely does), could be that is all you need to support a trio of Eclipse in long duration hunting. The Vulcan is a very under-appreciated ship, I think mostly because we've been given so little information about it.
 

Talonsbane

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Depending if the Vulcan has a bed, head, galley and airlock (which it likely does), could be that is all you need to support a trio of Eclipse in long duration hunting. The Vulcan is a very under-appreciated ship, I think mostly because we've been given so little information about it.
I can't agree with you more. I foresee the potential to be a must have ship in multi-ship fleets because of the multiple roles that it can assist the other ships in. I wasn't able to obtain a Vulcan during its concept, but I'll definitely be adding 1 to my fleet when I'm able to.
 
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Shadow Reaper

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BTW, one of the big things to happen in carrier group capability this last decade is the X47b attack drone has been modified to refuel others of its kind as well as F-35s. This essentially extends the range of all these other craft an indeterminate amount, which makes them very hard to second guess in simulations. The same is true of the Eclipse when paired with the Vulcan, and you can see this is what CIG intends since their Vulcan artwork is of it refueling an Eclipse.
 
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Grimbli

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Odds are that the hangar of the Polaris might also be able to carry & launch an Eclipse. With it's stealth abilities & those S9 torps, it could be quite useful in a cap battle where the Polaris is involved.
I know sizes have changed and all, but one of the main hoopla points when it was concepted was whether or not the Eclipse would fit inside. As they were both concepted close to the same time.

I believe the original answer was no, but might have changed. One way to tell now would be to figure out the wingspan of the Scorpius (folded and unfolded) to tell if the Eclispse is wider. As they said on a recent video that the Scorpius is intended to fit with wings folded, but unfolded they would be destroyed.


Edit: Yeah, looking at stats the Scorpius is 33m wide unfolded and the Eclipse is 36! I highly doubt it fits. Even with landing gear down and the tips folding up I imagine the Eclipse is still 33m wingspan. So you'll need an Endeavor hangar to launch the Eclipse from.
 

Talonsbane

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I know sizes have changed and all, but one of the main hoopla points when it was concepted was whether or not the Eclipse would fit inside. As they were both concepted close to the same time.

I believe the original answer was no, but might have changed. One way to tell now would be to figure out the wingspan of the Scorpius (folded and unfolded) to tell if the Eclispse is wider. As they said on a recent video that the Scorpius is intended to fit with wings folded, but unfolded they would be destroyed.


Edit: Yeah, looking at stats the Scorpius is 33m wide unfolded and the Eclipse is 36! I highly doubt it fits. Even with landing gear down and the tips folding up I imagine the Eclipse is still 33m wingspan. So you'll need an Endeavor hangar to launch the Eclipse from.
Actually, I was thinking more along the lines of the Eclipse landing tips up / gear down rotated 90 degrees. Which should fit it within the rectangular size of the hangar box lift.
 
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Grimbli

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Actually, I was thinking more along the lines of the Eclipse landing tips up / gear down rotated 90 degrees. Which should fit it within the rectangular size of the hangar box lift.
I haven't seen the new hangar, don't think we have a pic, but they also said when they changed the size that the weird shape was changed. Not sure what that means. But they did reference the XS landing pad. So I guess the best way to test would be to see if an Eclipse can spawn on the same size as a Sabre or Gladius. Might need to go to an outpost for that.
 

wmk

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/.../ Just a reminder that CIG recently confirmed that the Scorpius is designed to be able to fit inside a Polaris hangar, which means that the Vanguard line should as well.
I'd love to be able to transport Vanguard in it -- and I hope the ship design and art teams are going to make hangar bigger -- but Vanguard is definately larger than Scorpius or any other small size ship. From the recent Scorpius Q&A:

What size of ships does it fit into?
We designed the landed state to make sure it fits the metrics for ‘extra small’ or Size 2 landing pads. This is in line with the majority of our other fighters and allows it to fit inside a Polaris.

Scorpius is 30m long and 13.2m wide in the "store" configuration with folded wings, while Vanguard, a medium-size ship, is 38m long and 26.5m wide in landing configuration with folded wings.

 

Talonsbane

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Well, if they make the torps way to pricey, I will have to melt the Polaris because it won't be cost effective. It would be cool if you could get with the torpedo manufactures and do missions and get discount torpedoes through the Reputation system.
That would be very cool. Or perhaps they could have your ship be a spokes vessel showing your number of large Vanduul ship confirmed kills using their torps in exchange for a % off discount to keep using their product to win the war.
 
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