All this salt is just the normal cycle repeating!

[Amun Khonsu]

The hubris of CIG and the abuse of dissenting backers from 2012 - 2015 was palpable, and nearly led to me pulling out all of my funds (Sandi herself messaged me to refund me).

Some of this behaviour still exists.

There are advantages to not being held to account by a publisher. But what happens when you have a history of run-ins with the expectations of pubishers (looking at Freelancer), leave the industry, come back and raise more funds in crowdfunding history for a game that normally would be accountable to a publisher but has no accountability to one?

You get CIG today, trying to manage expectations of ordinary people. CIG is founded on disdain for expectation and deadlines.

Simple as that.

 

[KuruptU4Fun]

Does this mean no more game features in the PU until they are done with SQ42?

SQ42 is going to have bounty hunting, mining, cargo hauling, salvage, habs, base building, etc.?

I think what prioritizing SQ42 means for the PU is that we're going to see a lot of tools/features and AI upgrades that do NOT depend on SM or Quantum. Especially if they have a placeholder already in game.

So gadgets, salvage gameplay (and tool), hacking gameplay. With the SQ42 armorer in game as well as the bartender and the coffee shop vendor I think we'll see the progression to the AI and animations to store and vendor kiosk AI actually becoming interactive within the game.

Being able to sell stuff back to vendors will definitely keep people entertained for a patch at least. If we're waiting on SM/ Quantum then it makes sense to put in place the things that will connect to it immediately.

 

[KuruptU4Fun]

There is way too much confusion on this topic.

Lumberyard IS Cryengine.

CIG themselves said that the forking to Lumberyard was essentially something like 3 days worth of tweeks.

Lumberyard, being backed by Amazon is the perfect place to be for a game that is going to need to rely on the best server solutions on the planet.

I thought that Amazon had decided to discontinue Lumberyard prior to official release, while CIG was going to continue to use their server platform anyways, I guess I was wrong.

 

[Sky Captain]

I thought that Amazon had decided to discontinue Lumberyard prior to official release, while CIG was going to continue to use their server platform anyways, I guess I was wrong.

It appears that Amazon is still advertising Lumberyard: https://aws.amazon.com/lumberyard/?nc=sn&loc=0

And good point. What is the PU upside for more SQ42 focus? Gear, gadgets, animation, AI?

 

[Richard Bong]

I thought that Amazon had decided to discontinue Lumberyard prior to official release, while CIG was going to continue to use their server platform anyways, I guess I was wrong.

They open sourced Lumberyard. and now call it Open 3D Engine.

View: https://youtu.be/6ccjR9qI5YU


Funny, but not surprising, to see Tafi on there. :) I ran Software QA for the other half of that company a few years back.

 

[KuruptU4Fun]

Funny, but not surprising, to see Tafi on there. :) I ran Software QA for the other half of that company a few years back.

So now it's open source, which means that CIG could pursue selling their tools within the engine to other developers I would hope.

 

[Shadow Reaper]

It took CIG a few years to get itself operating as a "functional" game development studio. I would go as far as saying that a huge amount of work from 2012-2016 was probably tossed away because it simply was poor quality (eg original hangars) and better solutions, more skilled devs and artists came along.

I thought the hangars were fine and that it was too resource intensive to spawn so may hangars. Does anyone recall the reason for nixing the hangars at the time?

There are advantages to not being held to account by a publisher. But what happens when you have a history of run-ins with the expectations of pubishers (looking at Freelancer), leave the industry, come back and raise more funds in crowdfunding history for a game that normally would be accountable to a publisher but has no accountability to one?

No amount of accountability can make employees more productive. Apart from evidence that CIG has lots of lazy people, I don't think we can complain much. Chris has said from the outset that alpha will last as long as it takes to produce the quality experience he has in mind, so if you signed on for that, where is the basis to complain?

 

[Richard Bong]

So now it's open source, which means that CIG could pursue selling their tools within the engine to other developers I would hope.

That depends on the wording on the license.

 

[Richard Bong]

I thought the hangars were fine and that it was too resource intensive to spawn so may hangars. Does anyone recall the reason for nixing the hangars at the time?
No amount of accountability can make employees more productive. Apart from evidence that CIG has lots of lazy people, I don't think we can complain much. Chris has said from the outset that alpha will last as long as it takes to produce the quality experience he has in mind, so if you signed on for that, where is the basis to complain?

The hangars were either local or individual instances. The reason was it was poor, unmaintained code that wasn't worth the effort to bring up to standard.

Proper accountability and leadership makes employees more productive.

And the last as long as it takes is not from the outset. It is a much more recent comment from Chris.

 

[Amun Khonsu]

No amount of accountability can make employees more productive. Apart from evidence that CIG has lots of lazy people, I don't think we can complain much. Chris has said from the outset that alpha will last as long as it takes to produce the quality experience he has in mind, so if you signed on for that, where is the basis to complain?

I think it all speaks to the attitude and aggressive behaviour seen in CIGs postings to the community.

It is evident in the latest communications that has caused upset on Spectrum.

 

[Sirus7264]

So any thoughts on the 'sugar' we'll be getting next to break the salt-end of the cycle?

Release the kraken

 

[Sirus7264]

As we near the 10yr anniversary of the kickstarter in October, many see it as a line in the sand because its a big round number right?

It took CIG a few years to get itself operating as a "functional" game development studio. I would go as far as saying that a huge amount of work from 2012-2016 was probably tossed away because it simply was poor quality (eg original hangars) and better solutions, more skilled devs and artists came along.

It is fair to say that from 2016 to today, that CIG has been operating with a lot more focus and direction, like a proper game development company. Before that it was a whole bunch of overpromising, bad target dates and never ending scope increases.

As for the rabbit out of the hat for 2022, it as to be something that will re-kindle the excitement that has kept us around from the early days.

Not only do we need to see Nyx, but that Montreal office needs to show us a lot more. All these tools they have been working on for years, planet tech, atmospheres, procedural base and settlements, rivers, oceans, clouds. We need to see all this start to coalesce and demonstrate to the backers that all this money is being used as promised to speed up production of the final product we were promised a decade ago.

This includes SQ42.

How can Zyloh have played through all the levels in 2016? What happened to that version of the game? Its obviously been almost completely refactored, tell us why? GIve us the real reasons, we can handle it!

so well said i really think you should put out a video abou that.

 

[Richard Bong]

Release the kraken

OK, if that Rabbit is ready, the hat isn't empty.

 

[Shadow Reaper]

I think it all speaks to the attitude and aggressive behaviour seen in CIGs postings to the community.

It is evident in the latest communications that has caused upset on Spectrum.

Okay so, if lack of performance isn't the issue, but rather how CIG responded to supporter complaints, what we're really saying is the complaints themselves didn't have merit. If the complaints didn't have merit the complainers are the problem. It's waaaaaaaay tooo Millennial to think whiners all deserve to be heard.

You understand, this is again another generational thing. The current generation thinks Mommy is always going to be there to make it better. That's not a problem with CIG. That's a problem with a narissistic, presumptuous, entitled generation. You can't have it both ways. If we can agree this latest is result of complaints that have no substance, then how CIG replied to the fucking continuous nagging of this emotionally dwarfed generation really is secondary to the fact we have an emotionally dwarfed generation.

 

[Amun Khonsu]

Okay so, if lack of performance isn't the issue, but rather how CIG responded to supporter complaints, what we're really saying is the complaints themselves didn't have merit. If the complaints didn't have merit the complainers are the problem. It's waaaaaaaay tooo Millennial to think whiners all deserve to be heard.

You understand, this is again another generational thing. The current generation thinks Mommy is always going to be there to make it better. That's not a problem with CIG. That's a problem with a narissistic, presumptuous, entitled generation. You can't have it both ways. If we can agree this latest is result of complaints that have no substance, then how CIG replied to the fucking continuous nagging of this emotionally dwarfed generation really is secondary to the fact we have an emotionally dwarfed generation.

I dont doubt some merit in your viewpoint here. However, I know people who hold (or have run) or held important positions in a few large companies. I've never seen such a train wreck of PR as CIG. It's like they feel they have to respond to everything and in the worst possible way. Perception is everything in professional communications of any company that deals with the public.

I dont see anything wrong with what CIG is doing to manage expectations and refocus development, but the last communication could have been worded more professionally. Instead it sounded (as they have since the first time this happened) like a toddler throwing a tantrum, and offending a section of their customer base. Now the contoversy has given negative press and that is never a good thing for a company asking for more pledges.

 

[Richard Bong]

Okay so, if lack of performance isn't the issue, but rather how CIG responded to supporter complaints, what we're really saying is the complaints themselves didn't have merit. If the complaints didn't have merit the complainers are the problem. It's waaaaaaaay tooo Millennial to think whiners all deserve to be heard.

You understand, this is again another generational thing. The current generation thinks Mommy is always going to be there to make it better. That's not a problem with CIG. That's a problem with a narissistic, presumptuous, entitled generation. You can't have it both ways. If we can agree this latest is result of complaints that have no substance, then how CIG replied to the fucking continuous nagging of this emotionally dwarfed generation really is secondary to the fact we have an emotionally dwarfed generation.

IMHO it is both.
They fail to show any actual progress, then insult the community by blaiming the lack of progress on them.

We have a company that is selling an intangible at some future unannounced date, and has been for close to ten years. Ten years in and nothing is finished. Even the base tech needed to deliver an MMO is not done.

But it isn't their fault they can't deliver, it is ours.

Probably the most important part though is:

as well as to prospective Star Citizen fans watching from the sidelines at our Open Development communications.

They are afraid the "noise" is erroding the trust in their ability to deliver outside the current customers.

 

[Shadow Reaper]

But it isn't their fault they can't deliver, it is ours.

That's true, and even if it weren't it wouldn't be useful to blame the whiners or their parents. Blame never solves a problem. Still, you have to point out you have a problem before you can fix it.

View: https://youtu.be/hER0Qp6QJNU