Armor

[Shadow Reaper]

A thread for folks to think and endlessly rethink their home away from home. What do you like/dislike about armor suits? What mix and match do you find entices you? How much weight under what conditions do you usually carry?

And mystery question bonus points: what's the heaviest armor you can wear and still get into your pilot's seat--and is that just torso or does leg armor matter?

 

[Vavrik]

If I'm in the cockpit, I like the armor my avatar has on. It's a Greycat armor, so it's medium armor. The reason is basically mobility. If I'm going to be in ground combat, I have to mix and match heavy armor for head and chest, medium for arms and legs. In both cases for mobility, but protecting head and chest as much as possible. You honestly don't want to be carrying too much armor, eg the folks who carry heavy armor and two massive weapons are being just a little ridiculous IMO. Carry the right weapon for your role is all you need. Sometimes that's just a pistol, though I often laugh about carrying ballistic weapons in what's supposed to be space.

I've worn heavy armor to light armor in the pilot seat, and it does matter but only for esthetics. It is kind of funny to see someone wearing heavy armor in a light fighter, but right now it seems you can do that, while carrying a rocket launcher and a sniper rifle that is almost as big as you are, and a pistol, with 3 med pens, 3 oxy pens, grenades and reloads. When they walk, they make enough noise they can hear them on the next moon.

 

[Shadow Reaper]

I wasn't aware CIG was now allowing players to pilot while wearing Heavy torso. That was not the case for a long time.

How many are running around with all heavy, three guns, four grenades and a prayer no one shoots at them? Anyone here not aware of the movement calculator, hit speeds, exhaustion rates, etc?

 

[Talonsbane]

For me, my armor choices tend to change depending on what I'm expecting to do. On average, I'll run around in full Med armor just in case things get nuts suddenly. If I'm running around a city, I might rock some light armor in order to still be able to stow things like a couple bottles of water & a couple energy bars to stay hydrated & fed. If I know things are going to get critical, it's full heavy time.

 

[Vavrik]

Something CIG has done in addition to the exhaustion is tripping if you're running too fast. It'll happen unexpectedly, but there are conditions that it happens more often, like running up or down a ramp or staircase or uneven terrain. During a trip, you can't defend for a few seconds, which makes you totally venerable to other nearby players.

 

[Lorddarthvik]

I wasn't aware CIG was now allowing players to pilot while wearing Heavy torso. That was not the case for a long time.

How many are running around with all heavy, three guns, four grenades and a prayer no one shoots at them? Anyone here not aware of the movement calculator, hit speeds, exhaustion rates, etc?

Since heavy armor was a thing I was wearing and piloting in heavy torso (with light limbs and medium or light head), or when handheld mining came with the full body + integrated backpack suits.
I usually carry a Gallant (cos unlike most other guns it almost never bugged out on me, its accurate, and has enough ammo to kill 3-4 npcs easily. idgaf what some spreadsheet says how bad it is theoretically compared to x. It works.) and some cheap smg or a frag pistol. No nades (still to suicidey) and 2 stims.
If I go shopping or other just leisure activity I wear whatever looks best (medium+heavy torso sets mostly, blk and yellow ofc) with all slots filled to the brim if the stuff don't clip through too much (grenades suck at this) The flashier the better. The more and bigger the guns the betterer. Its just for show, and I don't like sprinting around like I'm a clown playing any regular mmo, so less speed and stamina don't matter.

I wish cig would implement the closets already so I can change into my long overcoat and such fancy civ clothes with a single click instead of spending minutes in the damn mobi glass...

Since inventory will be a thing, I'll stick to a gallant with scope + ammo on armor slots, some sorta pistol for backup with one extra mag, two stim packs and that's it. Maybe a bottle of water, food doesn't seem to be a limiting factor yet. I'll probably not change my armor setup as Ai still almost exclusively hits torso and I try to avoid pvp as much as possible.
As for the name/brand of the armor set, I dunno, they are all the same stats wise so the only question is what pieces I can find in black and yellow that have a nice matching style and the right hue.
Gotta say I really dig the Greycat set though, so might play around with that instead once 3.15 is out.

 

[Bambooza]

And here I just mostly been going with aesthetics and not worrying about what grade the armor is. Found the servers are often too buggy to reliably worry about taking fire as you either are shot through walls and die quickly or the NPC's are easy targets. Also with the way medpens worked it was easier to just spam them if you are getting shot at. Think the worse was forgetting to put back on a helmet when leaving the base as ships interior should have oxygen all over have lots of places where you can easily suffocate and die even while on a planet with a breathable atmosphere.

@Lorddarthvik is right that the kind of armor has not impacted one's ability to fly any ship but who knows for how much longer.

 

[Shadow Reaper]

I usually carry a Gallant (cos unlike most other guns it almost never bugged out on me, its accurate, and has enough ammo to kill 3-4 npcs easily. idgaf what some spreadsheet says how bad it is theoretically compared to x. It works.)

Purely based upon stats, I favor the Gallant over all other weapons. Take a peek here:

SC FPS data 3.14

docs.google.com

You'll see in cell 8U on the spreadsheet that the Gallant does 66.98 damage on a single burst (and it does this all the way out to 70m). This number is unusually high because the Gallan't burstfire is 5 very fast shots compared to the burstfire of other weapons, which are always 3 shots. This is enough damage to fire through the torso of heavy armor and kill an opponent with just one burst even while wearing a suppressor, and since the rifle has virtually no recoil, those shots usually all land on target. If you watch the Star Marine vids, most of the top competitors use the Gallant for this reason, and because it shoots across very great distance without losing power. It's common to kill at 70m with this weapon, so if you are outside mining, it is hard to imagine a better weapon. If you haven't tried the suppressor I encourage you to. It makes a huge difference because firing the weapon will not cause NPCs to aggro your position, and it's much harder for players to locate you since it also functions as a flash hider. Anyone running the 890 Jump missions should strongly consider adding a suppressor.

Perhaps the reason the Gallant is the first choice of the military and Star Marine competitors, is this flat shooting, long distance, low reload, low recoil, burstfire kill combination. BTW, the spreadsheet still says each Gallant battery is good for 120 shots. This is incorrect. It's good for 60 shots, which is 12 burstfires per battery. That means you're reloading much less often (which is when most deaths seem to occur in Star Marine.) The TTK with this weapon is longer than with other, harder recoiling weapons, but targets can't shoot you between the 5 shots they recieve from a burst, since they're busy being thrown about. So TTK is really not as important as people think. Low recoil so all the shots hit is much more important. Even though the Karna does more damge in less time with three shots than the Gallant does with 5, it recoils so much the third shot usually does not hit. Star Marine champions generally don't use Karnas. (I'm pretty sure this is all meant to emulate the difference between the American M4, and the Russian AK47.)

One thing to keep in mind when suiting up is your weight and movement rate. The faster you move, the harder you are to hit. NPCs have a terrible time hitting PCs moving at .85 and above. PCs struggle to hit targets moving at .9 and above. So IMHO, keeping your weight below 35 kg when armored is important. If you only carry the one weapon, and go medium arms and legs, this is very easy to do. You can still carry a multi-tool, 4 grenades, etc. You do not need a pistol according to the competitors. Lose what you can and choose speed and stamina.

Star Marine champions generally run all the time so they're hard to hit. Their running is limited by stamina so they dress light. If they're running slowly because of armor, they have other players run up from behind and shoot them. If they're running faster than other players they shoot others from behind. You can learn to run and fire from the hip if you round a corner and an opponent is suddenly there, and not bring the rifle to your shoulder unless you need the scope. Handy tips from the vids. Slow is smooth. Smooth is fast. Fast is deadly.

 

[Lorddarthvik]

Purely based upon stats, I favor the Gallant over all other weapons. Take a peek here:

SC FPS data 3.14

docs.google.com

You'll see in cell 8U on the spreadsheet that the Gallant does 66.98 damage on a single burst (and it does this all the way out to 70m). This number is unusually high because the Gallan't burstfire is 5 very fast shots compared to the burstfire of other weapons, which are always 3 shots. This is enough damage to fire through the torso of heavy armor and kill an opponent with just one burst even while wearing a suppressor, and since the rifle has virtually no recoil, those shots usually all land on target. If you watch the Star Marine vids, most of the top competitors use the Gallant for this reason, and because it shoots across very great distance without losing power. It's common to kill at 70m with this weapon, so if you are outside mining, it is hard to imagine a better weapon. If you haven't tried the suppressor I encourage you to. It makes a huge difference because firing the weapon will not cause NPCs to aggro your position, and it's much harder for players to locate you since it also functions as a flash hider. Anyone running the 890 Jump missions should strongly consider adding a suppressor.

Perhaps the reason the Gallant is the first choice of the military and Star Marine competitors, is this flat shooting, long distance, low reload, low recoil, burstfire kill combination. BTW, the spreadsheet still says each Gallant battery is good for 120 shots. This is incorrect. It's good for 60 shots, which is 12 burstfires per battery. That means you're reloading much less often (which is when most deaths seem to occur in Star Marine.) The TTK with this weapon is longer than with other, harder recoiling weapons, but targets can't shoot you between the 5 shots they recieve from a burst, since they're busy being thrown about. So TTK is really not as important as people think. Low recoil so all the shots hit is much more important. Even though the Karna does more damge in less time with three shots than the Gallant does with 5, it recoils so much the third shot usually does not hit. Star Marine champions generally don't use Karnas. (I'm pretty sure this is all meant to emulate the difference between the American M4, and the Russian AK47.)

One thing to keep in mind when suiting up is your weight and movement rate. The faster you move, the harder you are to hit. NPCs have a terrible time hitting PCs moving at .85 and above. PCs struggle to hit targets moving at .9 and above. So IMHO, keeping your weight below 35 kg when armored is important. If you only carry the one weapon, and go medium arms and legs, this is very easy to do. You can still carry a multi-tool, 4 grenades, etc. You do not need a pistol according to the competitors. Lose what you can and choose speed and stamina.

Star Marine champions generally run all the time so they're hard to hit. Their running is limited by stamina so they dress light. If they're running slowly because of armor, they have other players run up from behind and shoot them. If they're running faster than other players they shoot others from behind. You can learn to run and fire from the hip if you round a corner and an opponent is suddenly there, and not bring the rifle to your shoulder unless you need the scope. Handy tips from the vids. Slow is smooth. Smooth is fast. Fast is deadly.

edit: great writeup! Good tips for those who are just getting into the on-foot fighting part of the game. Thanks!

I can attest to how freakin awesome the supressor is against NPCs. I can usually clear a cave without any other shots being fired besides mine.
I didn't do any real scientific research on guns, but over time I came to the conclusion that I feel the most comfortable with the vanilla, aka the Gallant. it just works.

As for the armor and speeds, I just don't want to min-max everything. I'm not doing serious PVP or anything of that sort so I just do whatever looks good. I spent so much of my gaming time optimizing instead of enjoying that I just don't care anymore. My second reason is what @Bambooza said, especially in places like the 980J mission, with NPC-s bugging in and out and shooting through walls and closed doors, it feels kinda pointless for a casual like me.
With all that said, I'll be interested to see how the meta shifts with the new injuries/healing model.

 

[Shadow Reaper]

So far as I'm aware, the NPCs can only shoot through a short glass wall atop one staircase, while PCs cannot. So long as you're aware of this you can just move to the staircase. They're very unlikely to fix the problem since the wall has a handrail that would block some shots and not others.

 

[Vavrik]

So far as I'm aware, the NPCs can only shoot through a short glass wall atop one staircase, while PCs cannot. So long as you're aware of this you can just move to the staircase. They're very unlikely to fix the problem since the wall has a handrail that would block some shots and not others.

I think that what you just said is that CIG is applying collision detection to projectiles fired from player weapons, but not NPC weapons. That's just weird to have two collision detection methods. But from what I've seen it is most likely correct.

 

[Shadow Reaper]

Yes, it's been a problem since the mission was first released, but as I said it's easy to avoid. Don't try to shoot over the glass even though they are doing it.

I have wondered if this doesn't reflect the "defense bonus" CIG has mentioned they intend to place in all boarding missions. Somehow they intend to favor those already on a ship.