OMG please tell me you're still playing UO - I so miss my horse and my little keep. Miss that game so much!!
CIG wants $20 for the Citizencon livestream
- Thread starter Montoya
- Start date
I hope none pays I really do, I hope no one puts anymore money into this and they learn. I hope they get no audience at all.
That's not the point. I know that no one is forced to watch the stream, it's just the audacity of it. Intended or not, it just seems like they wanna milk their backers as much as they can. It just makes them look bad. They got so much money they could have developed Red Dead 2 with it and then ask the people who made that possible to pay 20$ to watch what their donation is used for.
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supitza
Vault Dweller
It's not about watching the stream.
I'm not going to give them $20, and I'm not going to give them any other $ until they stop sh***ing on the people keeping their business alive.
CIG, this was an unwise move. No matter how you try to spin it, it is going to look bad. Own it, say we fucked up, and move on.
I really do not get the people defending this by churning out the old "if you don't like it you can watch it on Youtube".
Do you actually not see the issue with this whole thing?
It's not difficult for me or plenty of others to show the restraint and wait till the uploads drop.
The fact is it shows the massive disconnect between CIG, the backers and the general public.
It shows how massively they have fucked up when they have had to backpedal this fast and try to save face by allowing people with an account to watch the keynote.
If they did nothing wrong they wouldn't have addressed it.
But it doesn't stop there because how have they managed to get this far into the plans and realise that is going to cost them stupid amount of money?
The whole organisation of this event is a joke, from location to date and clashing with other local events that have sent the costs spiralling.
Do you actually not see the issue with this whole thing?
It's not difficult for me or plenty of others to show the restraint and wait till the uploads drop.
The fact is it shows the massive disconnect between CIG, the backers and the general public.
It shows how massively they have fucked up when they have had to backpedal this fast and try to save face by allowing people with an account to watch the keynote.
If they did nothing wrong they wouldn't have addressed it.
But it doesn't stop there because how have they managed to get this far into the plans and realise that is going to cost them stupid amount of money?
The whole organisation of this event is a joke, from location to date and clashing with other local events that have sent the costs spiralling.
I'm okay with it and I am glad CR made the post and explained it better. I'll be there at the Con, and I also bought a digital pass to support them :)
Just all around bad communication/presentation again.. they don't seem to understand how the community reacts.
They could have just said right away earlier:
IMO
#1 issue, showing that stupid $20 live stream purchase item to existing subscribers and/or concierge without a proper explanation.
They could have just said right away earlier:
- Live keynote free to all backers with an account
- Rest of live event free to all subscribers and new subscribers
- Quality for YouTube content will be uploaded the next day
IMO
#1 issue, showing that stupid $20 live stream purchase item to existing subscribers and/or concierge without a proper explanation.
Umm, really? I should feel privileged that I get to watch the convention that is being made for Me, the Backer, and wouldn't exist without me in the first place? I should be happy that I get to PAY so I can watch them do presentations for a few days, that I payed for in the first place? Seriously? WTF?
Also, they have ALWAYS streamed CitCon and I could always watch it for Free. At least the keynote, which is frankly, the only important part although I quiet enjoyed some of the more technical presentations last year.
My point is, breaking with a "tradition" that the whole community took for granted is jarring. Yes, I do take it for granted that me buying into the game gives me the right to watch this shit for free, each and every year.
Have you ever watched any of these? There is one constant element in these: they keep telling us that the whole convention is made For US, the backers!
And now we are told that no, "it's for us the developers to see, and everybody who payed for us having this convention can just fuck right off unless they pay some more"? You think this is acceptable behavior?
"Fellas, if you dont want to watch, dont pay $20". No my friend, I do want to watch! That's why I'm angry as hell!
'Oh but CR explained it that it costs way too much, so they need more money!' Then DON'T DO IT! Nobody asked for this to cost 2-4 times more than the one you did last year!
But CR also said they never intended to stream it... BULLSHIT! They streamed it every single year! Ofc they were going to stream this as well. And the total bull about the "you all want HD video, not the crappy stream" is also BS. Last year and the year before (those are the oens I can clearly remember) they already had full 1080p streams that looked just as good as the supposedly higher quality ones they put on youtube later. I know cos I watched both (yes, I spend too much time on this).
Things that should have been said in the meeting where they decided on a PAYWALL:
-"Lets act like we are Blizzard!".
-No Chris! You don't get to act like Blizzard!
You are a small crowd funded company, with no products on the market, and no delivery date on any product yet! You have no trust from the press or the general public (your potential customers). Why the hell did you think you could act like you were Blizz?
You are not a multi-billion dollar company with 20+ million Paying Customers! Blizzard can afford to put streams behind a paywall because they have been delivering success after success for the last 25!!! fucking years! Blizzard is so successful that they Can easily pay for such huge conventions! It feels to them like paying for a cup of coffee. That's how small of an expense it is compared to their income. You don't have this kind of income!
You do not even have a product yet! You Can't afford this! You shouldn't be allowed to pay for this in the first place!
You only get to do payed stream after Star Citizen wipes the floor with WoW, but not before that! I don't think that will happen in our lifetime though...
I'm very disappointed. Both in CIG/CR, and in some of the backers who tell us that CIG doesn't owe us anything. The hell they don't! Get your heads out of your asses!
TL:DR.: Why should I, the backer, pay to watch their fun little convention, when I payed for it's existence in the first place? really CIG????
PS.: treating "suckscribers" and "just backers" as two totally separate groups is bullshit. Acting like, "oh, the suckscribers didn't pay enough so we can't afford this conevention, let's not take money from the backers, so let's make Everyone Pay!" is not a real argument!
It's a nice marketing pitch to suck up to subs and alienate the majority of the "just a backers". But that money that both groups payed is in the same hands! It's not separate in any way! If you sub, you don't pay to a separate company that is tasked with making nothing but Media and Events content! It's still CIG! It still goes into CR's "wallet" to do with it whatever he wants! They do pay for the convention from the "just backers" money. Cos that's the only money!
So the argument that "subscriubers" get to watch it cos They payed for it is a LIE. Backers payed for it, period. This includes everyone. That's the simple truth of it.
CIG, please stop dividing your player base, it fucking sucks to feel treated like shit again and again just cos I'm not a suckscriber anymore!
Warthogsmurf
Captain
I agree with this. And you don’t have to pay for information the YouTube will be posted ASAP after the keynote ( before it was behind a paywall) so everybody gets every information. Some ppl can’t even watch the livestream due to work or family live. Are they missing out on information because they don’t see it live ? Nope.
I find the move of CR reasonable because of lot of other con only stream the beginning and the end and not the other panels. Other do but then with a paywall. If you look at the schedule I doubt you really miss any important information after the keynote .
That’s said the 20 bucks ticket is worth double with all the goodies and stuff and the subscription is 29 worth already. Now I as a sub have to pay double for the goodies on top of the subscription , let’s talk about that will ya :-)
All in all it ain’t special at all and let’s enjoy citizencon on Oct 10 together now. The keynote is open for all. Let’s praise at least to the fact that CIG does listen to us.
I think you are getting entirely way too emotional over this. Everything presented at Citcon will go up on the youtube channel. So you get to see everything that happened and for free....
We are not as entitled as you think we are. We took the pledge knowing only that CIG would give us space pixels in the end. We are not entitled to more than that. Its in the small print.
In the end, shit costs money. This venue they are using, the staffing, the set up/tear down, all of it. Sure they have volunteers, but there are only so many of those people.
While I'm not thrilled by the fact that they have started charging for the stream, it really is something the was inevitable. They are doing bigger things with the CitCon and that costs money. They could have put it in the price of admission but as someone who is lucky enough to get to go, I'm glad they didn't do that as it wouldn't be fair to the people attending.
The fact of the matter is that big events like this cost money and I would rather have them charge a little for this than use the money that they already have for development, because that and not having the event are the alternatives. At least they are providing a way for people to watch and expanding the audience to people that can't physically attend. This isn't the first Con to be handled like this, in fact, I don't ever remember hearing people complain when Blizzcon moved to a more expensive version of this way of doing things.
The fact of the matter is that big events like this cost money and I would rather have them charge a little for this than use the money that they already have for development, because that and not having the event are the alternatives. At least they are providing a way for people to watch and expanding the audience to people that can't physically attend. This isn't the first Con to be handled like this, in fact, I don't ever remember hearing people complain when Blizzcon moved to a more expensive version of this way of doing things.
Yes, I am getting way too emotional! Because if I were logical about this, I would have asked for my money back years ago! lol
You still don't get the point do you? It's not about whether I get to watch it Later or not. Who gives a shit about Later? You can watch anything later without paying for it. Torrents still do exist you know.
This is supposed to be an event made for Us, in Our Honor, yada yada fancy marketing talk for covert marketing/press event. I do expect to watch it live, at the (almost) same time as the those who are there, as everyone else on the stream! To laugh with them as Red1 fucks up again, to stare in awe as the release date for SQ42 is announced, to talk with others about it on the chat as it's happening, and so on...
And I do expect to watch it for Free as they are doing it from the money we put into it! Not from the ticket sales, not from the digital passes, not from anything else, but Backer Money.
It's an event that happens that I care about! You don't seem to give a shit about it, either the event itself, or the fact that you are subscriber and this costs you nothing extra makes you ignorant. That's fine! Just don't tell me how I'm wrong to feel fucked over by them then!
GTFO with this "small print" bullshit, you know it's not true. I'm an original backer. Not through kickstarter, but through their webpage. And believe it or not, I did read every single letter of the agreement. It doesn't say that they can do whatever the hell they want with my money, no matter how much some of you are trying to push that idiotic idea. We were promised space pixels for our money. Not way too expensive conventions we can't watch for free.
It all costs money... I know!
You know, I really like that 108" 4K HDR 3D tv I saw in the ads, I should probably buy it for 15000usd... but thats like my yearly income x1.5 ... I wan't to eat next year, and I want my wife to not kill me by smashing in my head with that TV, so I just WON'T FUCKING BUY IT! Simple!
I don't give a fuck that they made this Huuuuge event that NO ONE WANTED! I certainly believe that many well paying whales wanted a larger event, but there is like a few hundred of them! Not thousands+!
I'm not gonna pay extra for it, just because they fucked up again!
But!
But, I still want my keynote, where CR lies.. I mean, tells us how we can expect interdimensional travel IRL in the next half a year, cos Star Citizen is now coming to the real world or some other fantastic shit, so I can keep my faith in them!
Becuase after aaaaalll these years of outright lies and fuckups and delays, I do want to see where this is going. And I do want to see it live, the minute it's happening, because I payed for it the event to happen. Not Intel, not Chris from his pockets, or some other unknown entity. Us, the backers payed for it. Is this too much to ask for?
They absolutely should have gone this route with the explanation. The way the information first went out last night it really seemed like they were going to keep everything behind a paywall.
You keep saying that no one wanted a bigger event. I'm just curious who's talking about that because outside of ticket sales and the announcements yesterday I haven't heard jack about CitCon. It just doesn't seem like something that is talked about much so I don't think they are necesarrily getting a ton of input on what people want to see at the show. Personally I don't have a problem with them going bigger as long as it is not funded from development money, which I don't think they are doing, but who knows.
I'm having beer while I watch the streams.
If you can not join me..... You can Purchase a Digital Drink Ticket.....
Just send $5 USD via PayFriend
This includes:
A Free Digital Beer Mug
A Free Digital Beer Mat
One Free Burp
*** Digital Snacks are Optional ***
If you can not join me..... You can Purchase a Digital Drink Ticket.....
Just send $5 USD via PayFriend
This includes:
A Free Digital Beer Mug
A Free Digital Beer Mat
One Free Burp
*** Digital Snacks are Optional ***
Fair points. I based my assumption on not wanting a bigger event on the tickets not selling out, and that I haven't seen anyone asking for it.
Anyways, I see that they made the keynote free to existing backers. That's good, but too little too late.
This whole paywalling is still a very bad business decision. It made backers angry, thus they won't pay. It blocked perspective buyers from getting in by watching the stream. They are still blocked cos they don't have an account.
It will generate a ton of bad press, that will dissuade those one the fence.
And ofc, it's just morally wrong.
When I told my wife about the situation, even before I would explain why this was important, she said: but how will they get new backers like this?
And she doesn't give a rats ass about SC!
I think that shows the extent of the problem pretty well.
Seriously what will be next? Will monthly subs suddenly come in (yes they said they wont but seriously can you even pretend to believe them?)
They need to start making some good decisions.
They need to start making some good decisions.