UEE Idris going down

[Esctasy]

Just wondering if Test has any plans to put together a team for the purpose of attacking a UEE Idris on patrol this coming up patch?
Rumor is there could be a pirate Idris as well.

Edit:
What types of fleet composition do you think we would need?

 

[Rustrabbit]

emp distortion and 2 eclispe

 

[BUTUZ]

5 tallys.

Job done.

 

[Han Burgundy]

Our Auroras shall blot out the sun. This is the way.

 

[FZD]

Okey, assuming it has 4 capital sized military shield generators, top of the line ofc.
Well, it's AI so it probably won't have the shields overclocked or anything. That gives it around 12k shield regen per shield face.
Not sure if the stats page is right about it having 4 large shield generators on top of the capital ones, that'd give 4k or so more shield regen (per shield face).
And it'd have like 600k hp per shield face, with the large generators it'd be around 700k hp.

So, let's say you hit it with 2 reliant tanas.
They do 10.5k dps with overclocked dominance-2 laser scatterguns, well, there's two so 21kdps. On top of that, both have 24 missiles for combined damage of 170k.

Those are small missiles, so probably most of them would hit, and they can be launched from relatively close anyhow.

For those two, it'd take around 2 minutes to blow up the ship, assuming they can get into the blindspot at the rear.

That's kinda long... So let's throw in a third tana!

31.5k dps, even if they use no missiles it would only take 45 seconds. With an optimistic "all missiles hit" scenario, just 30 seconds. They wouldn't even have time to run to the escape pods!


I mean, they'll likely fix the scatterguns eventually, but as of right now, they're just way OP.

EDIT: Oh wait, 4 cap 4 large is Javelin, Idris is 2 cap 12 medium. And if the full shield regen applies, well, that seems like you'd need to overcome 31440 shield recharge. So... more tanas!

 

[Mich Angel]

Operation: Borrow an Idris

UPDATE 2: Looks like the Idris might be steal-able after all. UPDATE: TRAGIC NEWS! View: https://youtu.be/6RylJpU_qJ4?t=2647 The UEE Patrol Idris in 3.12 will not be able to be taken over. CIG is faking the Idris, it will have no internals for 3.12. An investigation should be made, however...

testsquadron.com

 

[Mich Angel]

Operation: Borrow an Idris

UPDATE 2: Looks like the Idris might be steal-able after all. UPDATE: TRAGIC NEWS! View: https://youtu.be/6RylJpU_qJ4?t=2647 The UEE Patrol Idris in 3.12 will not be able to be taken over. CIG is faking the Idris, it will have no internals for 3.12. An investigation should be made, however...

testsquadron.com

 

[Mich Angel]

Operation: Borrow an Idris

UPDATE 2: Looks like the Idris might be steal-able after all. UPDATE: TRAGIC NEWS! View: https://youtu.be/6RylJpU_qJ4?t=2647 The UEE Patrol Idris in 3.12 will not be able to be taken over. CIG is faking the Idris, it will have no internals for 3.12. An investigation should be made, however...

testsquadron.com

Ooops!
Haa! What you know, I spamed !

 

[vahadar]

When 1 time isn't enough, 3 is better

 

[Esctasy]

Okey, assuming it has 4 capital sized military shield generators, top of the line ofc.
Well, it's AI so it probably won't have the shields overclocked or anything. That gives it around 12k shield regen per shield face.
Not sure if the stats page is right about it having 4 large shield generators on top of the capital ones, that'd give 4k or so more shield regen (per shield face).
And it'd have like 600k hp per shield face, with the large generators it'd be around 700k hp.

So, let's say you hit it with 2 reliant tanas.
They do 10.5k dps with overclocked dominance-2 laser scatterguns, well, there's two so 21kdps. On top of that, both have 24 missiles for combined damage of 170k.

Those are small missiles, so probably most of them would hit, and they can be launched from relatively close anyhow.

For those two, it'd take around 2 minutes to blow up the ship, assuming they can get into the blindspot at the rear.

That's kinda long... So let's throw in a third tana!

31.5k dps, even if they use no missiles it would only take 45 seconds. With an optimistic "all missiles hit" scenario, just 30 seconds. They wouldn't even have time to run to the escape pods!


I mean, they'll likely fix the scatterguns eventually, but as of right now, they're just way OP.

I'm sure there is something more than this. Right now scatterguns from NPC barely tickles my single FR86. Last patch or the previous one, I was attacked by players with scattered guns (sabre) and again it barely made a dent on the FR86.

 

[FZD]

I'm sure there is something more than this. Right now scatterguns from NPC barely tickles my single FR86. Last patch or the previous one, I was attacked by players with scattered guns (sabre) and again it barely made a dent on the FR86.

What were you flying? If it's a small ship, ironically enough, scatterguns do much less damage as most of the pellets miss. Against something like Javelin though, you won't miss.
I've been flying Reliant with 6 overclocked scatterguns, they take down larger ships in few seconds, while something like a buccaneer takes a minute or so. It's just ridiculous, kinda as if shotguns were entirely ineffective against ducks, but would just shred main battle tanks.

 

[Esctasy]

What were you flying? If it's a small ship, ironically enough, scatterguns do much less damage as most of the pellets miss. Against something like Javelin though, you won't miss.
I've been flying Reliant with 6 overclocked scatterguns, they take down larger ships in few seconds, while something like a buccaneer takes a minute or so. It's just ridiculous, kinda as if shotguns were entirely ineffective against ducks, but would just shred main battle tanks.

I'm in a 600i. The shield has a 4k recharge if I remember right. At PO, the sabre was attacking me for a long time, probably a few minutes in his Sabre. This was 1 or 2 patches ago.
However, even in this patch. The bounty missions has cutlass blacks npc outfitted with scatterguns, and they don't do much damage to me, the shield (on any face) basically goes down maybe 30% and then is right back up. Mine you that they only get a few shots out before they die except when they spawn too close to me and 4 or 5 are shooting at me.

Edit:
ClaimJumpers do a lot more damage. But what I notice is that when my shield is half way down, it charges to full again like within 1 or 2 seconds. Not really possible with a 4k recharge on a 76k shield.

Right after I get hit a few times, I always here that "Shield at ample strength" within a second or two. And my shields are back at 100%.

The bounty missions (all of them), I literally can just sit there and enjoy the star wars scene forever, their weapons just tickles my shield. The ClaimJumpers I can go straight on and take all the firing from the sentry, however, once in awhile it's too much and I have to dodge some.

Mind you that just the last patch, the ClaimJumpers could never penetrate my shield, I could sit there for infinity watching them shoot at me. This patch they buffed them up really good and they hurt now.

 

[FZD]

I'm in a 600i. The shield has a 4k recharge if I remember right. At PO, the sabre was attacking me for a long time, probably a few minutes in his Sabre. This was 1 or 2 patches ago.
However, even in this patch. The bounty missions has cutlass blacks npc outfitted with scatterguns, and they don't do much damage to me, the shield (on any face) basically goes down maybe 30% and then is right back up. Mine you that they only get a few shots out before they die except when they spawn too close to me and 4 or 5 are shooting at me.

Edit:
ClaimJumpers do a lot more damage. But what I notice is that when my shield is half way down, it charges to full again like within 1 or 2 seconds. Not really possible with a 4k recharge on a 76k shield.

Right after I get hit a few times, I always here that "Shield at ample strength" within a second or two. And my shields are back at 100%.

Hmm, well, 600i should be large enough, but there are many other factors which could play a part.
Firstly, they recently buffed scatterguns. Though they weren't weak or anything before, honestly I got no idea why they did it.
Secondly, maybe the guy was using just one scattergun? It's really hard to tell.
Also, maybe he was using Size twos? Could be he hadn't applied overclock.
Maybe he was at the edge of the range. Maybe he wasn't trying to destroy you but to bait you or something.
Could be he was just shooting manually. Y'know, a lot of factors that could play a part.

For comparison though, Sabre with 4 gimballed size 2 scatterguns without any overclock would still deal some damage against 600i.
Sabre with 4 gimballed CF-227 Badgers wouldn't even overcome the normal shield regen without overclock.

Then again Sabre with 4 fixed overclocked CF-337 Panthers would deal 2640 dps, against overclocked FR86 that'd be 947 dps (I'm fairly sure the shield regen is divided per shield face just like the HP). It'd take 20 seconds to take down one shield face.
Sabre with 4 fixed Dominance-3 would deal between 6188 to 8568 dps (the ship goes down too fast so the guns won't warm up properly), against overclocked FR86 that's 4495 to 6875 dps. It'd take 4 or 3 seconds to drop a shield face.
I mean, there is a huge, huge difference between knowing what you're doing and not.

And yeah, the AI cuttlasses with scatterguns don't really shoot them that much. Most AI ships don't really deal damage tbh, especially if I'm out with the Gemini, overlocked FR86 negates most smaller AI ships entirely.

 

[Esctasy]

Hmm, well, 600i should be large enough, but there are many other factors which could play a part.
Firstly, they recently buffed scatterguns. Though they weren't weak or anything before, honestly I got no idea why they did it.
Secondly, maybe the guy was using just one scattergun? It's really hard to tell.
Also, maybe he was using Size twos? Could be he hadn't applied overclock.
Maybe he was at the edge of the range. Maybe he wasn't trying to destroy you but to bait you or something.
Could be he was just shooting manually. Y'know, a lot of factors that could play a part.

For comparison though, Sabre with 4 gimballed size 2 scatterguns without any overclock would still deal some damage against 600i.
Sabre with 4 gimballed CF-227 Badgers wouldn't even overcome the normal shield regen without overclock.

Then again Sabre with 4 fixed overclocked CF-337 Panthers would deal 2640 dps, against overclocked FR86 that'd be 947 dps (I'm fairly sure the shield regen is divided per shield face just like the HP). It'd take 20 seconds to take down one shield face.
Sabre with 4 fixed Dominance-3 would deal between 6188 to 8568 dps (the ship goes down too fast so the guns won't warm up properly), against overclocked FR86 that's 4495 to 6875 dps. It'd take 4 or 3 seconds to drop a shield face.
I mean, there is a huge, huge difference between knowing what you're doing and not.

And yeah, the AI cuttlasses with scatterguns don't really shoot them that much. Most AI ships don't really deal damage tbh, especially if I'm out with the Gemini, overlocked FR86 negates most smaller AI ships entirely.

Shield regen is not divided per face. Each face on the FR86 recharges at 4k. I just did a start up test it takes 18 seconds for all 4 face to go from zero to 100. This would actually explain why my front shield goes back to 100% so fast.

Edit:
My bad, that test isn't useful. But I do believe that the 4k regen applies to any face. So if all 4 sides are damage than the 4k would be divided, but if only 1 side is damaged the full 4k will be applied to that one side. It would explain why my front shield charges so fast.

 

[FZD]

Shield regen is not divided per face. Each face on the FR86 recharges at 4k. I just did a start up test it takes 18 seconds for all 4 face to go from zero to 100. This would actually explain why my front shield goes back to 100% so fast.

Edit:
My bad, that test isn't useful. But I do believe that the 4k regen applies to any face. So if all 4 sides are damage than the 4k would be divided, but if only 1 side is damaged the full 4k will be applied to that one side. It would explain why my front shield charges so fast.

Hmm, well, I looked at few Camurals videos

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J2jN2AGQKXE
shame he didn't damage the shields more, but at 6:00 the banu defender took 96*2*3 = 576 damage.
The shield in question has 419 shield regen. If it was divided by 4, it'd take 5 seconds to heal the damage. If the whole regen applies, it'd take a bit over a second.
No matter how I look at it, seems like it only took a second to heal back to full, meaning you appear to be correct about the full shield regen applying.

As a proud owner of a starfarer Gemini, I wholeheartedly welcome this news. Overclocked FR-86 has 6772 continuous shield regen.

So, let's revise.
Sabre with 4 gimballed overclocked CF-227 Badgers can't even dent the 600i with FR-86, The shield regen completely overwhelms any damage.
Sabre with 4 fixed overclocked CF-337 Panthers can not even dent the 600i with FR-86.
Sabre with 4 fixed overclocked Attrition-3 (3698 dps at 299m) at optimal distance can't even dent FR-86.
Sabre with 4 gimballed Dominance-2 scatterguns (4675 dps) will barely dent the FR-86 (4369 regen) with 306 dps.
Sabre with 4 gimballed overclocked Dominance-2 scatterguns (7013 dps) will barely dent overclocked FR-86 (6772 regen) with 241 dps.
Sabre with 4 fixed overclocked Dominance-3 scatterguns (8568 dps) will destroy one shield face of overclocked FR-86 (6772 regen) in 10 seconds with 1769 dps.

I mean, the scatterguns are still pretty much OP, and for Sabre it seems like they're more or less the only choice against a 600i with FR-86. I mean, sure, there are ballistic weapons, but FR-86 at full health reduces even that damage by 95%.

Meanwhile my reliant setup would be 2 gimbaled Dominance-1 overclocked (2310 dps) and 4 Dominance-2 overclocked (7012 dps) for a total of 9323 dps. While I could get 1195 dps more by swapping those two gimbaled dominance-1s for fixed dominance-2s, the Reliant 2x2 wing mounts are gimbaled and I don't want mix of gimbal + fixed. Besides, Mixing dominance-1s gives a better stagger effect.
Anyhow,
My reliant (9323 dps) vs 600i with FR-86 (4369 regen) would take one shield face down in 4 or 5 seconds
My reliant (9323 dps) vs 600i with FR-86 overclocked (6772 regen) would take one shield face down in 8 or 9 seconds.

Lessons:
1. Scatterguns are OP
2. Always overclock the shield
3. You are either entirely invulnerable or die in a few seconds.

 

[Esctasy]

So in the scenario you presented with the Idris, you would need 8 tanas. I don't think you can find a blind spot that can fit 8 tanas in motion and stay there with all 8 tanas for 2 mins while the ship is moving rotating ect. One or two shot from any of it's gun at that range will be instant death.

 

[FZD]

So in the scenario you presented with the Idris, you would need 8 tanas. I don't think you can find a blind spot that can fit 8 tanas in motion and stay there with all 8 tanas for 2 mins while the ship is moving rotating ect. One or two shot from any of it's gun at that range will be instant death.

I mean, I got it confused: 4 cap 4 large was Javelin, 2 cap 12 medium is Idris, so you'd need just 4 Tanas, it'd take around 40 seconds without missiles. Don't think they'd fit in a blind spot though. Meanwhile 8 Tanas would destroy the Idris in roughly 10 seconds, which they could probably do while just flying straight at it, some evasive moves if the turrets start firing. And it'd take 2 seconds of sustained DPS from any of its turrets to drop one shield face of one tana, which isn't that easy as Tana is a small-ish target. I'd say that's a lot easier to setup than most other attack patterns, and you could even deal with any additional UEE forces there.

I mean, sure, couple retaliators launching missiles in a hit-and-run might work as well, but... that seems like the obvious solution, so...

Hmm... could also be 4x 325A's with 2x Dominance-3 and a Salvation distortion scattergun. 19k dps per ship, same defence as reliant.

 

[Esctasy]

What's the downside of over clocking? Just draws more power and the components degrade faster?

I've not touched any small ship for awhile. Last I tried to over clock my Sabre but ruled that out as I could fire non-stop when not over clocked, but the the same can't be said when I OC them.

 

[FZD]

What's the downside of over clocking? Just draws more power and the components degrade faster?

I've not touched any small ship for awhile. Last I tried to over clock my Sabre but ruled that out as I could fire non-stop when not over clocked, but the the same can't be said when I OC them.

Increased power draw and cooling requirement, basically if you plan on overclocking you might not be able to select certain components / you might not have enough resources to overclock everything you want. EM also affects how visible your ship is, though even for stealth setups that probably becomes pretty irrelevant once you're already in the battle blowing stuff up.
I've not noticed any sort of increased failure rate, though that could be a thing in the future.

 

[stockish]

All my time playing Star Wars Squadrons has led me to this, time to fly inside the shields and nuke everything from within!