Why you may want a Polaris

Dalarast

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It may seem like an oxymoron, but really there is such a thing as "military intelligence" and this is vital in real battle situations.
A lot of good points. I would expect it to take more than one barrage (4) of torpedos to take out an idris or larger. And that would be direct hits... but unless they develop a shield draining torpedo (EMP blast?) wouldn't their be a more effective way to take out a target? Obviously we're talking about unknown mechanics and I'm comparing it to what we currently have with dogfighting and comparing torpedos to missiles.


And true that the tali doesn't have the command center... but if your running multiple polaris ships on a attack run wouldn't it be better served by a ship that specializes as a "battle captain"? Be it a herald or a terrapin... jumps in identifies the targets and attack run.... with that thought the sheer attack strength of the torpedos (not all the other goodies of the Polaris) could be met with the tali.

And military intelligence. I have an entire 2 shop within my command... sadly I know their importance and the joy of telling them to find something "intellgient" to do and then go back to grunting about contractors "taking their jobs" in the best South Park voice I can do.
 

Bruttle

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I have one word for you that could, if in the plan at CIG, justify the Polaris as a semi-regular driver: Privateering.

UEE could issue Letters of Marque and Reprisal for pirate activity AND anti-Vanduul operations with rewards being paid. Large corporations, individual planets and systems, and of course larger Org's could do the same/similar as well.

I am thinking of naming my WarChip the ISS Marque and Reprisal.

'Gimp
I would love to see this sort of gameplay introduced. This would specifically cater to the Polaris owners (and possibly some other large ships) and give them a way to regularly enjoy their purchase. Otherwise, they'll just be wandering around the verse looking for a fight...
 

Blind Owl

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I have one word for you that could, if in the plan at CIG, justify the Polaris as a semi-regular driver: Privateering.

UEE could issue Letters of Marque and Reprisal for pirate activity AND anti-Vanduul operations with rewards being paid. Large corporations, individual planets and systems, and of course larger Org's could do the same/similar as well.

I am thinking of naming my WarChip the ISS Marque and Reprisal.

'Gimp
I intend to make privateering one of my primary sources of revenue. @Shadow Reaper has some really good ideas in this regard. I'd love to have a Polaris for this purpose, but again, the cost I believe would be prohibitive at the beginning of the game.
 

Blind Owl

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And military intelligence. I have an entire 2 shop within my command... sadly I know their importance and the joy of telling them to find something "intellgient" to do and then go back to grunting about contractors "taking their jobs" in the best South Park voice I can do.
Hehe, I'm just starting my career in "military intelligence". :P South Park and Star Wars references, haha.
 

Shadow Reaper

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Watched some twitch last night and stumbled across a group in chat suggesting using the Polaris as a bounty hunter / general big game hunter of ships for sport. Maybe a hunting contest.
Not sure what to say about that...
Corvettes are historically the ship of choice for pirates and privateers, who load them up with extra crew and use them for boarding actions.
CIG needs to give people a common enemy to fight soon or we will just feed on each other.... aka griefing. Welcome to the human race.
On the other hand.... More yummy scraps for my Reclaimer. I guess I have a little human nature in me as well.
The Vanduul, pirates and The Outsiders are all intended to provide just what you call for.

I have one word for you that could, if in the plan at CIG, justify the Polaris as a semi-regular driver: Privateering.
See the Privateering thread in the Profession folder. There are more than 30 players who have already expressed an interest, and just as noted above, the "grey" meaning "not really a bad guy" and UEE lawful types have three enemies to choose from and should not need official letters of marque, though that would be great if CIG writes specific missions like this with the letters.

I would love to see this sort of gameplay introduced. This would specifically cater to the Polaris owners (and possibly some other large ships) and give them a way to regularly enjoy their purchase. Otherwise, they'll just be wandering around the verse looking for a fight...
I doubt it is necessary to start with a Polaris to enjoy privateering. I am betting a single wing composed of 4 Hoplites and 2 Sentinels could take a Polaris from The Outsiders and make it their home. That requires 12 players all in the same time zone working together, and afterward they can add Hornet pilots and fly off the Polaris, but in any case no one is going to be doing much privateering alone. BTW, that is only 28 boarders which may well not be enough to take a Polaris.

According to CIG, boarding ships is going to be the most complex and challenging kind of gameplay in SC universe, and can only be accomplished by groups working together. If you are capable of that sort of coordinated, cooperative gameplay, send me a note and join us. I am not leading the group. I am merely facilitating its birth.

There are no private forums yet, so all contact on this issue needs to happen though private notes. Anyone interested should shoot me one.
 
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AstroGimp01

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Thanks Shadow Reaper, I had not seen the thread on Privateering, will now go look - especially since I see it as a very viable mechanism to support operating costs for the WarChip while also encouraging large and complex multi-player operations which is where I believe SC will shine from a player engagement standpoint.

'Gimp
 

Blind Owl

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Thanks Shadow Reaper, I had not seen the thread on Privateering, will now go look - especially since I see it as a very viable mechanism to support operating costs for the WarChip while also encouraging large and complex multi-player operations which is where I believe SC will shine from a player engagement standpoint.

'Gimp
Oh 'Gimp, I'd love to see you join us Privateering with your WarChip. Haha.
 

Shadow Reaper

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Pilfered from another thread:

"Updated on: October 19, 2016

In an effort to clear up confusion, we’ve consulted the designer for clarification and have a revised list of hardpoints. The Polaris current planned loadout is set to include:
• 4x S10 Torpedo Launch tubes
• 5x Manned Turrets (Twin S4 Weapons)
• 1x Remote Manned Turret (Twin S5 Weapons)
• 1x Automated Turret (Twin S4 Weapons)
• 2x Anti-Fighter Missile Racks, each carrying 16x S3 Missiles
As with other ships, feedback we receive through our usual channels and information gathered and received during playtesting and balancing may necessitate revisions of a ship’s hardpoint complement. Our primary focus will always be ensuring that any new additions to the game not only fulfill their intended roles, but also work in harmony with the vision and design intentions across the entire game."
https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/15564-RSI-Polaris-Q-A-Part-2
Just some thoughts on equipping this beast. . .

6 double S4 weapons turrets, one unmanned at rear says they wanted 6 turrets but left the last unmanned to create the continuing specific weakness in every ship's defenses that we have seen before. In this case there is still a mighty turret faced backward but it will be less effective than the others, so don't let enemies get behind this ship either!

Each owner will delight in assigning their favorite weapons to these turrets. I have seen one vid where the commentator was saying how he would use them to engage other cap ships. He obviously did not understand what this ship is about. If you engage other cap ships with these 6 turrets, you will get your ass kicked. That's not what they're for. You can intimidate lesser ships with these turrets, or destroy them, or fend off fighters, but you cannot engage larger cap ships with these weapons. That is what the torpedoes are for.

Y'all know I love the Omni XII's and I can't see a better option for these 6 turrets. Things change and we'll see come the day it flies. That is certainly my placeholder though, and with that in mind then the question comes, what do you use the beasty dual S5 remote turret for? That's the real treat aboard this ship. There's one additional, extra-super-size gun placement that is fired from the bridge, were the command crew has instant, direct influence on targets. Surely this weapon placement needs to cope with situations the others cannot? So how would you use it, and thus equip it?

IMHO, it would be of great benefit if that chin gun could accomplish three things: Spray fire past the 4km limit of the Omni's, knock down incoming torpedoes, and provide cover fire on terrestrial actions where the Polaris may indeed be the ruling emperor. It looks like whether flying through atmo, or silently hovering over a troop of soldiers scurrying out to meet the insectoid hoards (otherwise known as BEM's for Bug Eyed Monsters) what one really wants here is a gatling of some sort. Something that can spray a blanket of many shots across a large area. Since we don't need to worry much on this ship about running out of ammo, it could be laser or ballistic, but ballistic has better range. So what S5 ballistic gattlings are there?

Em. . .no really? Really? You're joking. Stop playing. That can't be right. Look at the chart:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/13LzkKzDOKIdrhwL5E2n2Co6THa74A2izxn8lykDuPAk/edit#gid=1241570521

The only S5 gatling does 240 dps? Look at these numbers. Everything but the BEHR M7A and Vanduul weapons has screwy numbers way too low for an S5 weapon. Could it be the Aegis Ballistic Repeater is supposed to do 1,240 dps? So that would be ~2,500 dps for the single turret? Sounds about right, especially given the shots are slow and spray around a bit.

In any case, a pair of S5 ballistic gatlings firing 800 rounds per minute total, might just shoot down an incoming torpedo, reach out past the range of the other standard weapons to ruin the day of pain -in-the-ass sniper fighters (with help from S3 missiles), and squash bugs on the surface like Decon was in town. Lets hope for decent S5 ballistic gatlings.
 
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JackAvalon

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Pilfered from another thread:


Just some thoughts on equipping this beast. . .

6 double S4 weapons turrets, one unmanned at rear says they wanted 6 turrets but left the last unmanned to create the continuing specific weakness in every ship's defenses that we have seen before. In this case there is still a mighty turret faced backward but it will be less effective than the others, so don't let enemies get behind this ship either!

Each owner will delight in assigning their favorite weapons to these turrets. I have seen one vid where the commentator was saying how he would use them to engage other cap ships. He obviously did not understand what this ship is about. If you engage other cap ships with these 6 turrets, you will get your ass kicked. That's not what they're for. You can intimidate lesser ships with these turrets, or destroy them, or fend off fighters, but you cannot engage larger cap ships with these weapons. That is what the torpedoes are for.

Y'all know I love the Omni XII's and I can't see a better option for these 6 turrets. Things change and we'll see come the day it flies. That is certainly my placeholder though, and with that in mind then the question comes, what do you use the beasty dual S5 remote turret for? That's the real treat aboard this ship. There's one additional, extra-super-size gun placement that is fired from the bridge, were the command crew has instant, direct influence on targets. Surely this weapon placement needs to cope with situations the others cannot? So how would you use it, and thus equip it?

IMHO, it would be of great benefit if that chin gun could accomplish three things: Spray fire past the 4km limit of the Omni's, knock down incoming torpedoes, and provide cover fire on terrestrial actions where the Polaris may indeed be the ruling emperor. It looks like whether flying through atmo, or silently hovering over a troop of soldiers scurrying out to meet the insectoid hoards (otherwise known as BEM's for Bug Eyed Monsters) what one really wants here is a gatling of some sort. Something that can spray a blanket of many shots across a large area. Since we don't need to worry much on this ship about running out of ammo, it could be laser or ballistic, but ballistic has better range. So what S5 ballistic gattlings are there?

Em. . .no really? Really? You're joking. Stop playing. That can't be right. Look at the chart:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/13LzkKzDOKIdrhwL5E2n2Co6THa74A2izxn8lykDuPAk/edit#gid=1241570521

The only S5 gatling does 240 dps? Look at these numbers. Everything but the BEHR M7A and Vanduul weapons has screwy numbers way too low for an S5 weapon. Could it be the Aegis Ballistic Repeater is supposed to do 1,240 dps? So that would be ~2,500 dps for the single turret? Sounds about right, especially given the shots are slow and spray around a bit.

In any case, a pair of S5 ballistic gatlings firing 800 rounds per minute total, might just shoot down an incoming torpedo, reach out past the range of the other standard weapons to ruin the day of pain -in-the-ass sniper fighters (with help from S3 missiles), and squash bugs on the surface like Decon was in town. Lets hope for decent S5 ballistic gatlings.
First, use this damage calculator, http://starcitizen.team/ , its super good and the guys keep it updated (Original Reddit thread for calc: https://www.reddit.com/r/path%3D%252Fr%252Fstarcitizen%252Fcomments%252F55u1nl%252F View: https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/55u1nl/dps_calculator/
)

Second, based off that calculator the Omnisky XII are a terrible choice for manned turrets and here is why. They overheat in 18 secs of continuous firing (which you will more than likely be doing in a turret) and it takes 25 seconds to cooldown from overheat. That's like forever in combat. Also, their DPS output will drop substantially when overheated (590 DPS norm; 249 DPS overheated). Their range while one of the best at 3900 meters is just going to cause people to miss more and fire for longer. I think we can all agree that in most scenarios, targets that are farther away are more difficult to hit. Additionally, the velocity of the projectile out of an Omni XII is 1950 meter/sec. So it will take 2 secs of flight time to punch out to max range (3900 meters).

Third, in a defend the Cap ship scenario (which if using turrets then you SHOULD be firing at non-cap ships), my overall recommendation goes to the M6A Laser Cannon(Size 4 for those who don't know). I also really like the Combine Ballistic Cannon but we have no data on how much ammo each turret will be able to have. Also, we dont know if we can store extra turret ammo in the Polaris and have runners essentially reload the turrets ammo stores when they get low (I would expect this process to take precious time when in combat if even allowed).

M6A Laser Cannon (PROS):

-With an Overheat Time of 1200secs, it just doesnt overheat.
-Technically fires more often over the Omnisky XII's: Fire Rate M6A = .43sec ; Fire Rate Omnisky XII = .5 sec
-Damage is competitive when considering DPS: DPS M6A = 455 ; DPS Omnisky XII = 590 , DPS of OVERHEATED Omni's = 249
-Round Velocity is higher than Omnisky XII: Velocity M6A = 2150 meters/sec ; Omnisky XII = 1950 meters /sec

M6A Laser Cannon (CONS)

-Currently, Range is only 1613 meters. Omnisky XII's have 3900 meters.(Not really a CON in my book as it will take the rounds .75secs to reach their target at max range vs the 2 SECONDS of flight to punch out to 3900m with the Omni's)
-DPS is less than Omni XII (at least until the Omni's overheat and they most definitely will)

Hopefully, this paints a pretty decent picture for everyone. This obviously may change as stats are adjusted with further development of SC and of course when new weapons are added.
 

Shadow Reaper

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Thanks so much for the calculator link! These are different numbers than I've seen but at least they did include things like the Omni XII which have still apparently not been released yet.

I have to respectfully disagree with regard to the heat and ammo concerns. It is decidedly NOT a good idea to shoot or plan to shoot constantly. If you burn power like that, it is not available when you need it for things like shields, and trigger discipline is always a good idea. Weapons that teach one to keep shooting create bad habits, and they always do far less damage than weapons that you are more careful about squeezing the trigger. Personally I think be it in a fighter or a turret, even though it does not feel as good to shoot less often, it is more effective. Most inexperienced pilots prefer shooting constantly, but this has serious drawbacks especially in a fighter, because it temps you to try to stay on target all the time and not fly defensively. This why you see Hornet pilots floating with no thrusters and simply aiming and shooting, as if they were in a turret instead of a fighter. People would never do this who believe if they got shot they would die.

This was certainly my experience in Mechwarrior. Experienced Mech pilots often filled up with very hot pulse lasers, that do more damage than other weapons but overheat quickly, then kicked their opponents asses simply by letting off the trigger. Think about this just for a moment because it affects weapon choice in fighters even more than turrets.

If you know your weapon will overheat or run out of ammo, you will plan to fire only on those occasions when you expect to hit. You will also be focused to fly defensively, and only make yourself vulnerable by turning in on your target when you're ready to dump hell on them. This ultimately makes you more defensive, and yet when you are delivering the goods you are doing much more harm. That at least is the theory behind it, and in almost all specifically designed "attack craft" including virtually all the Vanduul ships.

And I would note, it is not a great idea to use a short range weapon as a defense, because it is just too easy to thwart. However I do have to agree that for long range or short, faster is always better.

I'm thrilled with the damage the Aegis Ballistic Repeater does, but the range is very limited. Good for knocking down torpedoes maybe, but not for killing long range snipers. Given the S3 missiles maybe that is okay.

I definitely need to study this calculator more. Thanks again!
 
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Adiran

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Maybe your definition of a capital ship.

In eve online there were capital ships that were not combat focused or even capable. Capital mining vessels for one instance. http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Capital_Ships_101

In the strict sence every dictionary calls a capital ship things like "largest" and "most important". Is the Carrack not a capital exploration ship? No its not a combat ship, but there can be capital ships that are not combat focused.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nng3cBiLWtU
 
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Why buy a Polaris when you can buy 37.5 Auroras for the same price? Seriously people, how has this not been brought up yet?
This is HERESY! *BLAM*

Seriously, how much damage can you do by ramming 37.5 Auroras into a ship of the line? Not nearly as much damage as you can do by ramming a single polaris into the same ship AND it can blow fighters out of the sky while the ram is "in progress."
 
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