Profession starter ships

[Richard Bong]

With the Misc Expanse joining the ranks of profession starter ships, it may be time to consider something.
The profession starter ships, for the most part, have things in common. They are single seaters, with the basics to get the job done. It gives the player a chance to, "as the Earthers like to say, get your feet moist." (Londo Mollari)
There are three that have been stated to be the starter ship for a profession that requires a crew of more than one: the Liberator (Transport) the Cutlass Red (Medical) and the Vulcan (Repair/rearm and refuel), these three don't really enter into the equation, since they have medium or large fuel tanks and medium or large quantum drives.

Of the profession starter ships, all of the single seaters have one thing in common, small quantum drives with small quantum fuel tanks. That, realistically, limits these ships to working within a single system. Right now, since we have only one system, that isn't a big deal but it makes me wonder about the future.

It isn't like CIG has hidden this little piece of data, it was even specifically pointed out when the Liberator concept was revealed, but does the player base, in general, actually realize this?
It is fairly certain, when Pyro and Nyx get introduced, things like manning a turret will make more sense than flying your own ship. Or traveling from Area 18 to Levski will become problematic for the solo ship. For the "pirates" escaping to Pyro after blowing up a Prospector, for no apparent reason, in a Gladius, Arrow or Talon, doesn't really work.

What do you think will happen when the player base realizes their cool single player ship doesn't have the range to actually travel the galaxy?

 

[StdDev]

I think they will have to make friendly with a Starfarer pilot!

 

[Vavrik]

What do you think will happen when the player base realizes their cool single player ship doesn't have the range to actually travel the galaxy?

First, a lot of screaming. Especially in Spectrum.
Then there are those who will see this as a business opportunity.

Don't forget this is just the tip of the iceberg. Lots more systems to come.

btw this is also a good use for a Liberator., but might also be an alt role for some of the larger carriers

 

[Richard Bong]

I think they will have to make friendly with a Starfarer pilot!

Or a Liberator pilot.

 

[Richard Bong]

First, a lot of screaming. Especially in Spectrum.
Then there are those who will see this as a business opportunity.

Don't forget this is just the tip of the iceberg. Lots more systems to come.

btw this is also a good use for a Liberator., but might also be an alt role for some of the larger carriers

I agree that there will be lots of screaming. But will it hurt funding, since people may either be ticked enough to not fund, or decide they have to have the bigger ships, that cost more.

 

[Sky Captain]

My hunch is that 'being limited to one system' will not bear out. Sure they may not be able to quantum to other systems themselves. But I bet we ultimately see UEE Bengals and other NPC ships making routine traversals across star systems on which we could hop a ride. I'm guessing that player carrier pilots running a service for UEC will just be one of the (more convenient) options available.

 

[Richard Bong]

btw this is also a good use for a Liberator., but might also be an alt role for some of the larger carriers

BTW I am one of those Liberator pilots. :) I bought it mostly to move my better half's and my short range ships, which we intentionally limited because of range considerations, but I am open to making a buck or three moving other people's ships. :)

The Eclipse is a placeholder, not sure for what, yet. :) The Sabres were added only after the Liberator. :)

 

[Richard Bong]

My hunch is that 'being limited to one system' will not bear out. Sure they may not be able to quantum to other systems themselves. But I bet we ultimately see UEE Bengals and other NPC ships making routine traversals across star systems on which we could hop a ride. I'm guessing that player carrier pilots running a service for UEC will just be one of the (more convenient) options available.

I don't think we will see Bengals in that role. Krakens, yes. Liberators, yes. Something like but bigger than the Liberator, sure. But that isn't the way people play now, nor is it the kind of thing we hear in the various forums.

 

[Thalstan]

Ships will be able to be disassembled and shipped across many star systems in a commercial or friends Hull E (friend might cost you less, but probably more likely to be intercepted and lost, meaning an insurance claim.

liberators and Kraken will be able to take small ships around easily, and even small ships won’t be completely limited in range.

That said, small ships will be best suited for ground to orbit, inter-planetary system (Crusader to Yela), and the occasional and small high profit cargo or missions from Crusader to Hurston, etc.

Medium ships will be better within the Star system and making runs into neighboring systems. Freelancers will be much more of the Crusader to MicroTech ship, but can still do a MicroTech-Pyro II run If the cash is good. Systems limited to small size jump points will be limited to medium ship transport of good in/out.

large ships (Connie and bigger) will be mostly multi system ships, but can probably still do good business in-system.

Capitals will need to be Multi-system as the trade stations that can handle a Hull C/D/E will be only in certain places.

 

[Richard Bong]

@Thalstan Thanks for your thoughts. They make for an interesting discussion.

Vanguards are supposed to have a multi-jump range. So medium drives and medium tanks are implied to be intersystem, not just intrasystem.

The Hull-C is a large, not capital ship. I doubt it will have range longer than a Cat or Herc and maybe shorter with a full load.

I seriously doubt disassembly of ships will be a thing, but shipping containers for small and, possibly, medium ships, for carrying on a Hull-E and maybe a D I consider likely.

Since the Liberator is the "Starter Ship" for the transporter profession, I expect to see some more capable ships in this profession. I think large ships, will be on their own, for the most part, though. (Yes, a Pegasus carries a pair of Retaliators, but that is outside normal and more ship than we can buy.)

The big issue though is the single seat ships, which are, by far, the most common ships in the verse and which are definitely intended to be intrasystem not intersystem.

 

[KuruptU4Fun]

There are three that have been stated to be the starter ship for a profession that requires a crew of more than one: the Liberator (Transport) the Cutlass Red (Medical) and the Vulcan (Repair/rearm and refuel), these three don't really enter into the equation, since they have medium or large fuel tanks and medium or large quantum drives.

What do you think will happen when the player base realizes their cool single player ship doesn't have the range to actually travel the galaxy?

When it comes to medical personally I think "starter ship" is a misnomer obviously, however buying one should come from a point where a player has at least learned and highly proficient with combat medic support that requires pulling that person back from the front line, stabilize them enough to get them walking. While an Aurora is a 1 chair ship, if you've got a patient to that point they can ride to the nearest bed for full treatment. Just because the stats page suggests that it be operated with more than one player those characters can also be NPC's, and it's not a far stretch to make a hirable medic/ pilot NPC to fill out support on the ship.

 

[Vavrik]

My advice: Don't bank on NPC crew performance. So far the NPC's are dumb as a box of nails, and there is little evidence that they will ever become as smart as a box of screws. I would much rather have real life human crew who can follow the ship captain's orders and when needed, improvise. I think blades might be a better answer.

 

[Richard Bong]

When it comes to medical personally I think "starter ship" is a misnomer obviously, however buying one should come from a point where a player has at least learned and highly proficient with combat medic support that requires pulling that person back from the front line, stabilize them enough to get them walking. While an Aurora is a 1 chair ship, if you've got a patient to that point they can ride to the nearest bed for full treatment. Just because the stats page suggests that it be operated with more than one player those characters can also be NPC's, and it's not a far stretch to make a hirable medic/ pilot NPC to fill out support on the ship.

The Red is listed as the starter ship for the Medical profession. Unlike an Aurora, or other single person ship, the Red can stabilize a patient.

The Red has a crew of 2 and a Medium Quantum fuel tank and drive, making it one of the few profession starter ships with an, expected, interstellar range.

The majority of players has one single seat ship, which are likely to not be capable of interstellar operations.

You won't need an NPC, players will need a ride.

 

[Dirtbag_Leader]

So this is all pretty nebulous speculation of course, but I think the ED role model has a lot to offer here. In that game, yeah you need a bigger ship if you want to traverse the whole galaxy, but even a small starter ship can take a pretty long journey, it just takes a LOT longer because of all the smaller jumps/refueling needs. And then, if you get to an area of space that you want to camp out at for a while, you can pay a fee plus wait time to have your ships 'transported' there for you. I expect both of these things to be similar in SC. I'll bet you can hop you Vulture out to MT, refuel, then jump to Pyro (which will take something 'extra' since it just has a small jump drive), and then do one or two hops to somewhere inside Pyro to refuel. Or, you can get there quickly in your Carrack, and then use a station kiosk to claim/transport your Vulture, and then take it out to salvage that hulk you found. You can already go anywhere in Crusader with a small ship, even though it takes a while, and often using something with a Crossfield and then claiming is faster, but that doesn't mean you CAN'T just fly the smaller ship there. So I sorta expect this to all just scale accordingly: mostly possible, but at the expense of a bit of a time-grind.

 

[Talonsbane]

I don't think we will see Bengals in that role. Krakens, yes. Liberators, yes. Something like but bigger than the Liberator, sure. But that isn't the way people play now, nor is it the kind of thing we hear in the various forums.

@Thalstan
Since the Liberator is the "Starter Ship" for the transporter profession, I expect to see some more capable ships in this profession. I think large ships, will be on their own, for the most part, though. (Yes, a Pegasus carries a pair of Retaliators, but that is outside normal and more ship than we can buy.)

The big issue though is the single seat ships, which are, by far, the most common ships in the verse and which are definitely intended to be intrasystem not intersystem.

Personally, I'm potentially ignorantly, holding out hope that CIG will release a capital carrier from Origin that will compete with the Kraken & Idris in terms of ship transportation capabilities, but have interiors that are meant for a more refined class of ship transporter. Think luxury ship super ferry that will also have state rooms for those transporting the ships from the deportation port on to the carrier, then off the carrier to the destination location.

 

[Bambooza]

The Red is listed as the starter ship for the Medical profession. Unlike an Aurora, or other single person ship, the Red can stabilize a patient.

The Red has a crew of 2 and a Medium Quantum fuel tank and drive, making it one of the few profession starter ships with an, expected, interstellar range.

The majority of players has one single seat ship, which are likely to not be capable of interstellar operations.

You won't need an NPC, players will need a ride.

I have to wonder if it's also a misnomer about the need to travel the galaxy. CIG seems to be spending a great amount of time and energy on making sure that each planet and location has lots of things to do so while starter ships might be limited in range they are not going to be limited in things they can accomplish. Games like ED required large distance as a gameplay mechanic to create progression as well as like prior games spread out resources/tasks to be a time sink. While SC has a similar time sink in the form of travel time it's more local in the amount of time required to travel to a poi on a planet or moon or from station to asteroid field. And none of this as far as the Stanton system requires jump drives or lots of fuel, while systems like Pyro will have fewer fuel stops and thus more cooperation between players/npcs it still seems like the vast majority of starter ships will still be able to operate effectively in the region but will require more skill/risk.

I have a feeling that most players will travel around to a degree but more likely will be within a given region for most of their playtime.

 

[Shadow Reaper]

. . .I'm potentially ignorantly, holding out hope that CIG will release a capital carrier from Origin that will compete with the Kraken & Idris in terms of ship transportation capabilities, but have interiors that are meant for a more refined class of ship transporter.

I'd be thrilled to find something like the Lib that is just a tiny bit bigger and has a dozen beds.

I have to wonder if it's also a misnomer about the need to travel the galaxy. CIG seems to be spending a great amount of time and energy on making sure that each planet and location has lots of things to do so while starter ships might be limited in range they are not going to be limited in things they can accomplish.

CIG says they are committed to the idea that the universe is too big to explore fully, easily. You might spend time in every system eventually, but it will take serious effort. Most players should not see it all. Certainly not those grinding. It will become a badge of honor to know something of every system and well traveled adventurers will be considered huge assets to those they crew with. Light haulers are typically well traveled, and hence suited to exploration. Scoundrels will be flying the MSR, noting what's "nothing compared to a good blaster at your side, kid." I think it is pretty likely CIG will still be releasing new ships and systems, 25 years from now.

 

[Richard Bong]

I'd be thrilled to find something like the Lib that is just a tiny bit bigger and has a dozen beds.
CIG says they are committed to the idea that the universe is too big to explore fully, easily. You might spend time in every system eventually, but it will take serious effort. Most players should not see it all. Certainly not those grinding. It will become a badge of honor to know something of every system and well traveled adventurers will be considered huge assets to those they crew with. Light haulers are typically well traveled, and hence suited to exploration. Scoundrels will be flying the MSR, noting what's "nothing compared to a good blaster at your side, kid." I think it is pretty likely CIG will still be releasing new ships and systems, 25 years from now.

25 years from now I am unlikely to care. Given the rate of technological advancement, CIG is likely to be a distant memory for most of us, 25 years from now.

Light haulers depends on what you classify as light. Smaller than a Cutlass is likely to be restricted to in system due to fuel range. The intent of the Cutlass was stated as limited endurance. Now if light haulers starts at the Freelancer, then, sure.

 

[Richard Bong]

I have to wonder if it's also a misnomer about the need to travel the galaxy. CIG seems to be spending a great amount of time and energy on making sure that each planet and location has lots of things to do so while starter ships might be limited in range they are not going to be limited in things they can accomplish. Games like ED required large distance as a gameplay mechanic to create progression as well as like prior games spread out resources/tasks to be a time sink. While SC has a similar time sink in the form of travel time it's more local in the amount of time required to travel to a poi on a planet or moon or from station to asteroid field. And none of this as far as the Stanton system requires jump drives or lots of fuel, while systems like Pyro will have fewer fuel stops and thus more cooperation between players/npcs it still seems like the vast majority of starter ships will still be able to operate effectively in the region but will require more skill/risk.

I have a feeling that most players will travel around to a degree but more likely will be within a given region for most of their playtime.

When I think "best damn space sim ever" I expect to be travelling the stars, not making the shuttle run from Phoebus to Europa.

 

[Richard Bong]

Personally, I'm potentially ignorantly, holding out hope that CIG will release a capital carrier from Origin that will compete with the Kraken & Idris in terms of ship transportation capabilities, but have interiors that are meant for a more refined class of ship transporter. Think luxury ship super ferry that will also have state rooms for those transporting the ships from the deportation port on to the carrier, then off the carrier to the destination location.

I want a Pegasus.