Banu Defender

Shadow Reaper

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Jun 3, 2016
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Fairly certain they said it'll have extremely powerful shields, but low armour.
You may be able to direct them, but they are S1 shields, and the refresh rate will certainly reflect this. Expect them to be better than than most S1 shields, but not by a lot. Most serious fighters have S2 shields. The Reliant has S4 shields.

Read the brochure!
You read the brochure and then tell us all why we should believe that instead of the ships page and the detail page. While these things directly contradict one another it is just a guess which is right.

Big target? It's 28m long, which is 2m longer than the Sabre and it's not nearly as wide, even with the 2 seats.
It's a big target. It is the same size and mass as the Reliant, and also has 12 S1 maneuvering thrusters. The Reliant handles poorly for a fighter, rotating slower than even the huge Vanguard. This is because the design includes a very large "moment arm" were the bulk of the mass is not found near the center of mass. When you move structure away from the center of mass, that structure's bulk requires much more force to rotate the craft. Like the Reliant, this ship is going to handle very poorly.

Low speed and maneuverability? Here's a quote from the brochure: "Lighter armor and heavier Tevarin shields keeps the fighter light and fast , which is ideal for quick maneuvering during combat ."
I have a bridge I want to sell.

You know they said that same thing about the advanced Xian armor on the Reliant, and the Reliant can't take a hit and handles like crap.

No missiles? The missiles are in the undercarriage as the brochure points out
Maybe.

No armor!?!?! Yeah.... it's got no armor... you got that one right.
Which is the main thing that makes the Tana a poor choice. Fighters need to be able to handle more than harsh language. This is not near a match for the SuperHornet, which is cheaper. Maybe it could beat a Tana, but that does not make it a wise choice, especially given the crappy view.

It actually only has 4 S3 gun mounts, and 2 S3 Missile mounts, the S3 gun mounts will come stock equipped with S2 Guns on S3 Gimbals, and the Missiles will have 2 S3 Double racks sporting 4 S2 Missiles most likely, just like pretty much all the fighters, even the hornet has S3 missile mounts, but they only mount the racks, so its an S3 rack that can carry 2 S2 missiles. The way they do the stats pages makes it really hard to properly understand what the ship will have.
The stats and detail pages say it has no missiles. It is easy to believe one person made the same mistake twice there, so I would guess you are right. If that is so, looks like they are building a Tana competitor. Note the brochure talks about limited cargo space and the specs page says there is none. Someone is a serious screw up.

Quick analysis of the 6, 2-man crew fighters: Superhornet, Gladiator, Vanguard, Tana, Hurricane, and Defender says to me you are mad to even consider something other than the various Vanguard, but I admit to being biased. Just don't talk yourself into the"invulnerable shield" nonsense. There is an advantage that The Tevarin shields are directional, but they are S1 shields. You should presume the Vanguard's 6 shields are far better, as that fighter was designed to be the big CIG battlecannon. 6 shields give an incredible refresh rate.
 

Grimm_Reaper

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May 22, 2014
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Saw the crab, wallet shut so tightly that it would be easier getting into Fort knox. Glad CIG for the first time made the decision this easy. I do not anticipate any major changes in design and viewing angles. That being said, most likely a hangar trophy for alien ship collector enthusiasts.
 

Stevetank

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You may be able to direct them, but they are S1 shields, and the refresh rate will certainly reflect this. Expect them to be better than than most S1 shields, but not by a lot. Most serious fighters have S2 shields. The Reliant has S4 shields.

You read the brochure and then tell us all why we should believe that instead of the ships page and the detail page. While these things directly contradict one another it is just a guess which is right.

It's a big target. It is the same size and mass as the Reliant, and also has 12 S1 maneuvering thrusters. The Reliant handles poorly for a fighter, rotating slower than even the huge Vanguard. This is because the design includes a very large "moment arm" were the bulk of the mass is not found near the center of mass. When you move structure away from the center of mass, that structure's bulk requires much more force to rotate the craft. Like the Reliant, this ship is going to handle very poorly.

I have a bridge I want to sell.

You know they said that same thing about the advanced Xian armor on the Reliant, and the Reliant can't take a hit and handles like crap.

Maybe.

Which is the main thing that makes the Tana a poor choice. Fighters need to be able to handle more than harsh language. This is not near a match for the SuperHornet, which is cheaper. Maybe it could beat a Tana, but that does not make it a wise choice, especially given the crappy view.

The stats and detail pages say it has no missiles. It is easy to believe one person made the same mistake twice there, so I would guess you are right. If that is so, looks like they are building a Tana competitor. Note the brochure talks about limited cargo space and the specs page says there is none. Someone is a serious screw up.

Quick analysis of the 6, 2-man crew fighters: Superhornet, Gladiator, Vanguard, Tana, Hurricane, and Defender says to me you are mad to even consider something other than the various Vanguard, but I admit to being biased. Just don't talk yourself into the"invulnerable shield" nonsense. There is an advantage that The Tevarin shields are directional, but they are S1 shields. You should presume the Vanguard's 6 shields are far better, as that fighter was designed to be the big CIG battlecannon. 6 shields give an incredible refresh rate.
You do make a couple of points but remember that there are only 4 sizes now for shields. 1 is the small one for small ships. 2 is the bigger ones for freelancer / Constellation size ships. 3 is Caterpillar, Gemini, and other such ships. 4 is capital sized. Not that CIG ever updates things. Normally the newest ships are close, though never fully correct.

(Constellation may have an s3 shield, I dunno)

The Reliant will have the appropriate shields once CIG gets around to actually putting components in all of the ships.

That S1 shield on the Defender is an S1 because it's the appropriate shield for its size. The Prowler has S2 shields.

I don't really think the Tevarin shields will be any good, like you say. It's like putting all of your power and hp on 1 face at all times and expecting people to gang up on you or come at you when you are not prepared to fight them. There is a reason why the UEE did not adapt Tevarin shields.
 

NaffNaffBobFace

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I don't really think the Tevarin shields will be any good, like you say. It's like putting all of your power and hp on 1 face at all times and expecting people to gang up on you or come at you when you are not prepared to fight them. There is a reason why the UEE did not adapt Tevarin shields.
Have you ever been in a Battle Royal AC match and seen the trains that form behind a runner? The chaser, the chasers chaser, the chasers chasers chaser...

Sometimes I wonder if one shield face is all we need, the one covering our asses...
 

Shadow Reaper

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Shadow Reaper
I don't really think the Tevarin shields will be any good, like you say. It's like putting all of your power and hp on 1 face at all times and expecting people to gang up on you or come at you when you are not prepared to fight them. There is a reason why the UEE did not adapt Tevarin shields.
It may work better for the Prowler. In an assault ship one hopes you are controlling the engagement, so have an opportunity for example to face your enemy and put the shield where you want it. For fighters this might also work if all you ever did was the jousting style CIG is working to get rid of. Most dog-fighting though, has one ship get behind another, and if your shields do not face backward you would be very vulnerable.

Remember too, that shields will probably never work well against projectile weapons. In something with low maneuverability and low hull, you are meat on a stick for a Hornet carrying a pair of S4 ballistic cannon and even a Ghost Tracker that specializes in everything but weapons load-out can do that. While I really love the Sabre, the Hornets still seem to be the baseline fighter everything else is compared to, and very hard to beat.

Yeah, I had forgotten they went to just 4 shield sizes. It is extremely annoying to me that so much time has gone by and still they sell ships and yet don't think we ought to have objective means to compare them. It really should not take more than a day or two to iron out all the component sizes, set a single standard and update the ships page. Its dopey and embarrassing to have so may errors.
 

Stevetank

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Have you ever been in a Battle Royal AC match and seen the trains that form behind a runner? The chaser, the chasers chaser, the chasers chasers chaser...

Sometimes I wonder if one shield face is all we need, the one covering our asses...
I don't live long enough to see trains. My lag grants teleportation to all the ships, so I normally just die against players. Vs AI in single player I do alright.

It may work better for the Prowler. In an assault ship one hopes you are controlling the engagement, so have an opportunity for example to face your enemy and put the shield where you want it. For fighters this might also work if all you ever did was the jousting style CIG is working to get rid of. Most dog-fighting though, has one ship get behind another, and if your shields do not face backward you would be very vulnerable.

Remember too, that shields will probably never work well against projectile weapons. In something with low maneuverability and low hull, you are meat on a stick for a Hornet carrying a pair of S4 ballistic cannon and even a Ghost Tracker that specializes in everything but weapons load-out can do that. While I really love the Sabre, the Hornets still seem to be the baseline fighter everything else is compared to, and very hard to beat.

Yeah, I had forgotten they went to just 4 shield sizes. It is extremely annoying to me that so much time has gone by and still they sell ships and yet don't think we ought to have objective means to compare them. It really should not take more than a day or two to iron out all the component sizes, set a single standard and update the ships page. Its dopey and embarrassing to have so may errors.
Tevarin shields will definetly be something to explore.
 

KruzMachine

Lieutenant
Jun 6, 2021
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Yes I think it will be a monster. I'm hoping so anyway as the current internal design seems way too limited for the ship role. It is touted as a home as much as a cargo transport yet in the CIG concept art it has bunk beds as opposed to individual cabin space, and that really gives it the feel of a utilitarian transport. If they do it justice then we're talking at least a 30% size boost.

Still there's hope that they may be converted from BMM to BPB (Butuz Party Boat). Either way, I think it's going to be a thing of beauty.

I want to turn my BMM into a space cantina.
 

Talonsbane

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I really dig the aesthetics of the Banu based on the Defender. I'm really looking forward to seeing how the BMM turns out & wondering if there will be any other Banu ships to enter the Verse in the future.
 
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