is the Carrack undermanned?
- Thread starter Thugari
- Start date
Richard Bong
Space Marshal
You left out "Away team."
In reality the ship should have a crew of around 12 to carry out a
its exploration functions. More as a military scout going into harm's way.
However, this is a game and consistently putting together a crew of 12 is not realistic, unless you are in Test Squadron.
Most MMO have team sizes of 4 with 8 for special occassions. The Hammerhead, and the Retaliator are difficult to fully crew with a crew of 7 and 9.
I agree...I think people expect to much out of this ship, its not a full time military vessel where you need all positions manned at the same time, this a converted civilian vessel now, its main task is exploration and pathfinding, combat is not a primary role here.
I also hope or maybe this has been talked about already I don't know, but ships with remote turret control imo should be able to have a link option that would give a single remote station the option of having the turrets link together to be used on a single target, that the turrets would fire only when the target is in their field of view, yes this defeats the advantage of having multiple turrets firing at multiple targets but could come in extremely useful if crew was light or busy doing emergency repairs etc and a crewman had to abandon their station for emergency or maybe they were injured etc...
I feel like the Reclaimer stations should be able to cycle to a turret that has an enemy in its view. Because theres like 6 remote turrets split between 2 stations, you can't man them all.
Does it have 12 beds? I thought it was 6, hard to 12 man a ship designed for extended space travel with only 6 beds. As for away teams, your ship doesn't even have to be manned for these types of missions and the ship can be piloted by a single person for the purpose of picking up or dropping off players.
Also it says pathfinding and exploration, nothing about being a military scout vessel, this ship was converted for pure exploration purposes not combat and I think people are trying to turn this into something its not, its not meant to lead a fleet or scout for military fleet engagements, ya I am sure it can be used this way but its not its main function so its not built to serve in that capacity.
I also disagree with the MMO 4-8 people special occasions, WoW is 15 years old and when it started it had 40 man raids regularly on weekends and even still today regularly puts 15, 20 and even 30 man raids together with ease and is still hands down the most played MMO on the market at about 3 million subscribers, if the game is done right people will make themselves available, 12 people will never be an issue let alone 6 if the game is done properly.
In the end I think they created this ship for pure exploration, map charting and discovery functions, they made it so you could do it with a relatively small crew which is smart, the stations were never meant to be manned simultaneously but rather in an as needed basis. In simpler terms its like an R.V. you have a kitchen, bathroom, bed and t.v. etc... but when your driving to your destination you are not actually using all the amenities it offers but rather as needed.
I feel the same way in some regards, but the Reclaimer isn't remote turret operated, its manually operated turrets, so I don't agree with this assessment it would be to overpowered imo. I think the key factor here is remote turrets compared to manual turrets, remote turrets should have a link option, manual turrets not so much.
I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. There's a station behind the pilot room where there are 4 spots. Two of them say "Enter Remote Turret". Isnt that what a remote turret means? Controlled from a bridge station and not actually sitting in it?
I'd just like a way to cycle through those turret cameras instead of shutting it down and then guessing which turret now has visibility.
Absolutely you are correct for some reason I had Retaliator on my brain, lol.
Ahh, good. Thought I was going crazy.
I'm actually thinking of getting a second account so I can have 2 people logged in and operate turrets like in the Hurricane or a mining laser in the Mole and not have to get out of my seat lol. I'm so lazy.
Plus it'd let me use one account for legit stuff and one for illegal things.
But then you'd have to run two sets of controls by yourself, lol. Sounds like multitasking. Jesus, I have a hard time driving a beer and watching TV at the same time.
It actually wouldn't be all that hard. Running around would be a bitch, but if I left it in the pilot seat I could have joysticks for flight and a pad for quick button commands. I'll bet I could even set up macros to do certain tasks.
Need to get a pad kinda like this:
I prefer a simpler approach, just have a link option that links all the remote turrets to the pilot or one station, each turret would fire at your reticle when they have line of sight and the others just wouldn't fire at all, this would make the system useable by a single person. Yes it would only be viable against a single target but I believe this would solve some issues where crew size is minimal or in emergency situations where players are off the ship or performing emergency maintenance.
I have one of those.
Ok, wow. Y'all are getting into geek-speak beyond my understanding, haha. You make this sound so simple.
Richard Bong
Space Marshal
It isn't about the beds, but the crew requirements. How many hours a day do you spend in bed?
The mission appears to require, at a minimum, pilot, engineer(s), shuttle pilot, astrogator, sensors, 2 drone operators, doctor, nurse, 2-4 person away team, 4 gunners.
Crew of 6 is pilot, Engineer and 4 gunners. You have to, basically, abandon ship to explore the surface of a moon or planet. You certainly couldn't operate this ship 24 hours a day with a crew of 6.
The shuttle pilot doubles as the co-pilot.
The Pilot is also the ship's Captain.
Combine Astrogation with Sensors?
Can you really get by, in a ship this size, with only one Engineer?
What do you do, out in the black, if the Doctor gets hurt and doesn't have a PA?
Do you abort the mission every time the ship faces a threat?
Now when you are out in the black, you need more crew and most of the crew to be proficient in multiple roles. You can't afford to make due with less.
The Carrack is military first, civilian second. Pathfinder or Scout, same thing.
WOW is not every MMO, Star Citizen does not have anywhere near that userbase size. Even in WOW, typical party size is 4, if you exclude a party size of 1. In fact many MMO, TOR for example, limit party size to 4 unless it is a "Raid."
How many friends can you count on to regularly crew your ship, at the same time?
They don't have their own ships to fly?
So the crew size is a compromise between what the mission needs and MMO practical sizes.
I have a Tali and right now it is, normally, hangar art due to crew requirements. And the Tali has more of a singular purpose than a Carrack.
Last edited:
So, I've been going around trying to speculate what an optimal crew for a Carrack might be out in the expanse of the open Verse. Currently I'm sitting at a crew of 11 which are:
Pilot, co-pilot, navigator (Captain), 2 engineers, 4 security (turrets), Dr & Assistant Dr.
If the scout in the hangar is a Pisces (3 seats):
The away crew would effectively be crewed by a team of the ships co-pilot, 1 security & 1 engineer that are all trained in 1st aid to some degree.
Which would leave the Carrack with a crew of the pilot, navigator (Captain), 1 engineer, 3 security (2 turrets & 1 drone), Dr & assistant Dr.
With 1 of the security leaving & another moving to operate drones, the remote turrets they would usually operate can be placed on auto / point defense operation to keep those bases covered.
What do each of you think of this crew arrangement?
Pilot, co-pilot, navigator (Captain), 2 engineers, 4 security (turrets), Dr & Assistant Dr.
If the scout in the hangar is a Pisces (3 seats):
The away crew would effectively be crewed by a team of the ships co-pilot, 1 security & 1 engineer that are all trained in 1st aid to some degree.
Which would leave the Carrack with a crew of the pilot, navigator (Captain), 1 engineer, 3 security (2 turrets & 1 drone), Dr & assistant Dr.
With 1 of the security leaving & another moving to operate drones, the remote turrets they would usually operate can be placed on auto / point defense operation to keep those bases covered.
What do each of you think of this crew arrangement?
Even though CIG has said once before multiboxing will be a no no, I think they have already backed away after letting all the referral people get away with making lots of accounts. That said, this isn't the easiest game to multibox, as many actions would be more of a botting aspect.
That said, I am hoping that the NPCs you can hire make up for the inability to multibox cleanly.
That said, I am hoping that the NPCs you can hire make up for the inability to multibox cleanly.
AstroGimp01
Space Marshal
Having had access to her for a while now and played around with some exploratory flights I offer the following:
The crew cabin is a lot of wasted space IF you consider a true combat vessel with large crew requirements - in a US Navy ship that same space could bunk twice as many, maybe 3 times - BUT - as I understand it in lore this is not an into-the-fire vessel so much as a pathfinder - that would mean longer duration deployments and that is why you get a pool table and some wasted space - it is intended to allow for some downtime.
Put another way, IMO this is not like the Enterprise where you send a bunch of red shirts down to the planet, it is much more like Firefly, you take the ship down planetside and your crew is maybe 4-8 total, it is not a 24\7\365 working ship so much as a lifestyle ship that is really only working when the captain is up and about.
I do think it should have 3 or 4 more bunks but realistically an away team would be the exception not the rule, Pisces only truly fits 3 although could probably be the whole crew except possibly a pilot to remain aboard the Carrack (or a solid AI who alerts you to approaching vessels\attempts to board, etc.).
Overall, I see myself using her as a Connie on steroids - a little bit commercial shipping\transportation, a little private excursion\fun, and some exploration along with the occasional mercenary mission.
'Gimp
The crew cabin is a lot of wasted space IF you consider a true combat vessel with large crew requirements - in a US Navy ship that same space could bunk twice as many, maybe 3 times - BUT - as I understand it in lore this is not an into-the-fire vessel so much as a pathfinder - that would mean longer duration deployments and that is why you get a pool table and some wasted space - it is intended to allow for some downtime.
Put another way, IMO this is not like the Enterprise where you send a bunch of red shirts down to the planet, it is much more like Firefly, you take the ship down planetside and your crew is maybe 4-8 total, it is not a 24\7\365 working ship so much as a lifestyle ship that is really only working when the captain is up and about.
I do think it should have 3 or 4 more bunks but realistically an away team would be the exception not the rule, Pisces only truly fits 3 although could probably be the whole crew except possibly a pilot to remain aboard the Carrack (or a solid AI who alerts you to approaching vessels\attempts to board, etc.).
Overall, I see myself using her as a Connie on steroids - a little bit commercial shipping\transportation, a little private excursion\fun, and some exploration along with the occasional mercenary mission.
'Gimp
This is why when I listed what I'm thinking, I started with what it would take to be a well staffed team in a variety of situations, then used which staff could be extra to be the 3 person away team.
Richard Bong
Space Marshal
Thd bigger problem for as starship is not the number of bunks but life support capacity. While the Carrack is not s "combat vessel" it is also designed for, unlike a freighter or tanker, for solo operation away from support.
Which, IMHO, makes it both undermanned and under gunned.
Richard Bong
Space Marshal
The cargo are modular bays.
Living module, like the Retaliator?
Living module, like the Retaliator?