"Limited" ships upon release

[Bambooza]

This limited rare wreck seems like a good concept, I'd love to get my hands on an original 300, but it also ties into the pay2win argument. If your definition of "win" is getting a limited ships like the one you mentioned (it is for me), those with little time will probably not find it, and will have to buy it off of the person who could spend 24/7 to get it, and then put it up for sale for an exorbitant amount of UEC. Thus the player with little time, but probably a thick wallet, could buy it with real money. Thus I would "lose" , cos I probably won't have enough time or money to get it. I'm not saying this is necessarily bad, it's like real world economy or like EVE, but it still makes me a bit sad lol

This is always the hardest part of game design. Make the rewards to easy and they lose their value and the game itself becomes dull and the player population moves on. Make it too difficult and the game becomes frustrating and the player population moves on.

There needs to be a progression of difficulty with the upper limits being hard and only really achieved by a small percent of the players. Luckily within SC even in an Aurora or Mustang, you can still participate in most of the game and contribute to the cause. Even more exciting is the fact that you don't even need to own a ship to play and be a valuable member of the team as you can be a Marine or ship crew. And this I have to say I am really looking forward to seeing how it plays out for its something unique in the market.

 

[Vashpede]

This is always the hardest part of game design. Make the rewards to easy and they lose their value and the game itself becomes dull and the player population moves on. Make it too difficult and the game becomes frustrating and the player population moves on.

There needs to be a progression of difficulty with the upper limits being hard and only really achieved by a small percent of the players. Luckily within SC even in an Aurora or Mustang, you can still participate in most of the game and contribute to the cause. Even more exciting is the fact that you don't even need to own a ship to play and be a valuable member of the team as you can be a Marine or ship crew. And this I have to say I am really looking forward to seeing how it plays out for its something unique in the market.

Agreed! I like a good challenge and am fine with it taking time as long as it does not become super tedious.

I am also extremely excited to see how that all plays out. I have my small crew ships (Corsair and Apollo) for "with a friend" play or solo play, but I also can not wait to be in a crew. I think I will spend a good portion of my game play being in someones crew as a turret man, repairing components in big ass ship battles, boarding party, medic, etc. I do not like leading large numbers of people but I do enjoy being a part of a good crew.

 

[Bambooza]

I think I will spend a good portion of my game play being in someones crew as a turret man, repairing components in big ass ship battles, boarding party, medic, etc. I do not like leading large numbers of people but I do enjoy being a part of a good crew.

This is the part that gets me excited about the game. I don't want to be stuck to in the bridge I want to be part of the away team. Or checking in on Scotty and finding out when we can go pew pew again.

 

[Vashpede]

This is the part that gets me excited about the game. I don't want to be stuck to in the bridge I want to be part of the away team. Or checking in on Scotty and finding out when we can go pew pew again.

Exactly! I daydream about the possibilities and how things will play out. I envision a large battle going on and being a crew member on a big capital ship running around and repairing damages to keep the ship afloat. We get boarded, run the armory and grab a rifle and are defending the ship against other players like the scene where Vader and the Stormtroopers are looking for Leia and the stolen plans. Except not getting massacred by Darth Vader haha.

 

[Cugino83]

This limited rare wreck seems like a good concept, I'd love to get my hands on an original 300, but it also ties into the pay2win argument. If your definition of "win" is getting a limited ships like the one you mentioned (it is for me), those with little time will probably not find it, and will have to buy it off of the person who could spend 24/7 to get it, and then put it up for sale for an exorbitant amount of UEC. Thus the player with little time, but probably a thick wallet, could buy it with real money. Thus I would "lose" , cos I probably won't have enough time or money to get it. I'm not saying this is necessarily bad, it's like real world economy or like EVE, but it still makes me a bit sad lol

I get your point but that will depend on how good is that rare ship compared to the standard one.
Does it just looks better? Does it have different hardpoint? Does it fly better becouse it's more agile?...

Ihad played MachWarrior Online for several years, and MWO have some Mech that are not available for in-game cash, you can buy them ONLY with real money.
Are those P2W? Not at all.
The Pay-only mech are simple variant of the standard one, with a custom skin, some different detail and sone different hard point so that allow a player to equip very unique configuration for that type of mech, but alos trade-in some other one, and there are other mech that can sport the same configuration.

I'll expct CIG will go form the same way, so special variant of the ships, with custom skin and maybe a slighty different hardpoint setting, like, for example, a Mustang with a S4 nose hardpoint instead of the turret.
Will it be a P2W ship? No it won't becouse it stil be a Mustnag, with the same flaws of that ship, and there are other ship that can sport a S4 gun on the nose... better ships actually.

The problem will rise when the rare and unique item will provide a sensible game-advantage that you couldn't get in any other way no metter what.

 

[Vavrik]

That sounds fun, I just hope that maybe there are different systems where you can earn that same rep, in this example Militia, and different ways to do it. Maybe a couple systems around there that have pirate slaying, delivery missions, maybe some S&R, etc. I would just hate to spend a week grinding rep in the same system, around the same planet, doing the same thing over and over. I know it has to be a grind and I think it should take time to do it, just with some variety hopefully.

Oh hell, I hope there is some variety too, otherwise this is going to be a lot like WOW.

 

[Vashpede]

Oh hell, I hope there is some variety too, otherwise this is going to be a lot like WOW.

My thoughts exactly, that is one thing that drove me away from WoW.

 

[Lorddarthvik]

I get your point but that will depend on how good is that rare ship compared to the standard one.
Does it just looks better? Does it have different hardpoint? Does it fly better becouse it's more agile?...

Ihad played MachWarrior Online for several years, and MWO have some Mech that are not available for in-game cash, you can buy them ONLY with real money.
Are those P2W? Not at all.
The Pay-only mech are simple variant of the standard one, with a custom skin, some different detail and sone different hard point so that allow a player to equip very unique configuration for that type of mech, but alos trade-in some other one, and there are other mech that can sport the same configuration.

I'll expct CIG will go form the same way, so special variant of the ships, with custom skin and maybe a slighty different hardpoint setting, like, for example, a Mustang with a S4 nose hardpoint instead of the turret.
Will it be a P2W ship? No it won't becouse it stil be a Mustnag, with the same flaws of that ship, and there are other ship that can sport a S4 gun on the nose... better ships actually.

The problem will rise when the rare and unique item will provide a sensible game-advantage that you couldn't get in any other way no metter what.

Nope, you misunderstood me. I don't care if that ship is good or not!
You are correct, as long as you care about the performance of this very very rare ship. I don't! I care about owning one, like a collector.
You see, the definition of "winning" is very different for all of us. I don't care if that rare ship has poor performance compared to its cost, or it's overpowered compared to its size.
I care if I can obtain such a rare ship without having to pay real money or spend a prohibitive amount of time grinding Uec for it.
Spending 2 years working away at getting enough UEC to buy your very own standard 890Jump is perfectly fine with me. It's a big ass expensive ship.
Having to spend 5+years grinding UEC to get a rare mustang variant, because someone who could play 24/7 in the first couple of months got that ship before I had a chance, or pay a 1000USD and have it, is not something I would like to happen. I'd call that pay2win.
In my definition, pay2win is like in battlefront2, where ypu could technically grind enough credits in 10-15 years for the things they were selling for money, but it was unreasonable. So you either had to buy then with real money, or not have them ever.


Tldr.: I don't care how good that rare ship is, to me its not just pay2win if the rare ship is overpowered, it's pay2win if I can't obtain that ship with reasonable time investment so I have to pay real money or never have it.

Anyways, sorry for derailing the thread, carry on with the limited ship talk!

 

[Vashpede]

Nope, you misunderstood me. I don't care if that ship is good or not!
You are correct, as long as you care about the performance of this very very rare ship. I don't! I care about owning one, like a collector.
You see, the definition of "winning" is very different for all of us. I don't care if that rare ship has poor performance compared to its cost, or it's overpowered compared to its size.
I care if I can obtain such a rare ship without having to pay real money or spend a prohibitive amount of time grinding Uec for it.
Spending 2 years working away at getting enough UEC to buy your very own standard 890Jump is perfectly fine with me. It's a big ass expensive ship.
Having to spend 5+years grinding UEC to get a rare mustang variant, because someone who could play 24/7 in the first couple of months got that ship before I had a chance, or pay a 1000USD and have it, is not something I would like to happen. I'd call that pay2win.
In my definition, pay2win is like in battlefront2, where ypu could technically grind enough credits in 10-15 years for the things they were selling for money, but it was unreasonable. So you either had to buy then with real money, or not have them ever.


Tldr.: I don't care how good that rare ship is, to me its not just pay2win if the rare ship is overpowered, it's pay2win if I can't obtain that ship with reasonable time investment so I have to pay real money or never have it.

Anyways, sorry for derailing the thread, carry on with the limited ship talk!

I can agree with that, it's already pay to win as people who have all these pledge ships, such as myself, will be steps ahead of a mustang/aurora package. Pay2w to me is simply anything that you can spend real money that will give you any sort of advantage at all over people that do not spend money.

 

[Tealwraith]

My understanding, from what a dev said, is that a vehicle like the Nox Kue will NOT be available after launch. The Kue version is just a different skin of the Nox. He said you will be able to get a Nox and it will perform exactly as the Nox Kue and you can upgrade it the same as a Nox Kue so it will function exactly as a Nox Kue, but it will be a Nox. You will also be able to paint your Nox a silver to look like a Nox Kue, but you will never be able to get exactly the same color and look as a true Nox Kue. So, some special skins will never be available in game, but they are special, limited edition skins and have no effect on the function of the vehicle. If you need to have the limited, collector edition skins, buy them now for cash. If you are only interested in functionality, everything will be available to earn in game.

 

[Cugino83]

Having to spend 5+years grinding UEC to get a rare mustang variant, because someone who could play 24/7 in the first couple of months got that ship before I had a chance, or pay a 1000USD and have it, is not something I would like to happen. I'd call that pay2win.
In my definition, pay2win is like in battlefront2, where ypu could technically grind enough credits in 10-15 years for the things they were selling for money, but it was unreasonable. So you either had to buy then with real money, or not have them ever.

I totally agree with that point and there are a lot of game that actually do that for "standard" item where high tier equipment require an amount of in-game money that you can get only with years of constant game play or right now by paing real money. Try them, and leave them as soon as I reach the actual the-facto p2w wall.
I also don't like the litem that yoy can get them like 1/1mil chance... I'm fine with grinding, but it should be a reasonable amount of time. Then if there is also an option to buy it real cash... well that's an option some people whould prefer, no complain on it...

 

[Vashpede]

I totally agree with that point and there are a lot of game that actually do that for "standard" item where high tier equipment require an amount of in-game money that you can get only with years of constant game play or right now by paing real money. Try them, and leave them as soon as I reach the actual the-facto p2w wall.
I also don't like the litem that yoy can get them like 1/1mil chance... I'm fine with grinding, but it should be a reasonable amount of time. Then if there is also an option to buy it real cash... well that's an option some people whould prefer, no complain on it...

I am cool with it as long as it does not give others some kind of advantage over someone that does not have a deep enough wallet. I get the "not enough time to play so pay" and "all the time in the world so grind" but then you run into people that have all the time in the world as well as deep wallets that will be miles ahead because they could buy it. I just prefer in games to not have any kind of items you can buy with irl money unless it is cosmetic, and if it is not cosmetic, something that will not give any extreme type of advantage like that. Whether someone has time or not, it's just like life, you have to spend time earning in. Some people will be able to and some will not. Either way I will be playing this game because its a dream come true if they do everything else right, but I prefer not having that advantage for anyone.

 

[BUTUZ]

I aim to unlock the yellow test skin pack by grinding hard up against testies.

Any volunteers? :D

 

[Vashpede]

I aim to unlock the yellow test skin pack by grinding hard up against testies.

Any volunteers? :D

Hmmm tempting!

 

[Shadow Reaper]

I'm not familiar with any statements that rare ships will be available in game only. I know CIG has said there will be rare components available in game only and not for sale (until a player tries to sell them.) That seems to me to provide a great balance. Even a cooler, if it does the job better than what you can buy, will make a mission worthwhile. And if you have a hankerin' for those Vanduul plasma weapons, I'm pretty sure the only way to get them is blow up and salvage a Vanduul ship. From past specs released it does seem the Vanduul plasma weapons are ideal first strike weapons, so if what you want is to practice highwayman tactics, you'd want to go farm Vanduul ships.

For rare coponents, I think too the Tevarin shields are planned to be like this? Maybe you can get them on a Prowler, but really you'd want to hunt the cosmos for downed Tevarin ships in order to get the huge benefits of a directional shield that takes more hits and has faster refresh than is otherwise available, though you the need someone to point that shield actively. It's a big deal. Since the Polaris lacks cap class shields, it can't plan to take big hits on the nose while it sits back and launches S10 torps, unless somehow the owner found some really big, pointable shields otherwise not available in game. That's a great reason to fly the missions.