New World MMO! Who wants to try it? Launch delayed to SPRING 2021!>>>:(

Gambit

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Mar 15, 2016
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Gambit
Thanks for the information, Heartwood. Fun is the important (and very complex) keyword and I feel it gets kinda forgotten along the road in so many projects.

I tried Albion for a month and felt obligated to join big zergs to get more progress - which was something I did not desire and simply left. A pitty, that game made me remind a lot of Ultima Online (I have a LOT of good memories with UO).

I'll check ser medieval for some slight-hype for this party that is coming!
 

DontTouchMyHoHos

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DontTouchMyHoHos
Im gonna drop a text bomb now.

Albion Online - a german game that did it mostly wrong is now being sort of reimagined into new world done by professionals (thank god).

Played the alpha to release, gave feedback in form of ~ 1000 posts on their forums, made it to round table and exchanged personal messages with the developers and a couple with the CEO.
The game had a ton of potential, all lost due to PVP enforcements. Over the course of 3 years, the dev team managed to first pull in players with the promise of player driven economy and pvp only to then walk back on it in favor of a pure pvp build.

We had 300+ members in our guild (Casual United) and we did farming and supply runs for pure pvp guilds. People were focused on crafting skill lines, you had to unlock every single one. There was 1 (useful) character per account and things were looking great. People whispered you if you were known for being a good crafter. Guilds had roles to fill and life skill players enjoyed bein needed and being useful.

Then they came up with Learning Points as a subscription and allowed multiple characters per account. They reduced crafting skill lines into families (swords for all 1h, 2h + special), increased farming timers from 8h to 22h, put a bottle neck on T5 resources to push people into red zones (full loot), they made most T5-T7 resources into pvp hotspots, did not limit alliances and did not regulate city plot auctions.

The result was a shit show; manipulative players throwing cash at devs to get a headstart for plots, buying most city plots, then put up a tax to remove and dominate any rival.
Crafters were not needed as you just made 3 characters, 1 pvp, 1 refining and 1 crafting alt, gave all three the sub bonus and circumvent using the market.
Farmers were left in the dust of multy account players and zerg guilds, abusing the 22h timer to put 1-3 people in charge of 150+ farming plots, creating a massive overload of horses and food, allowing their dominace to grow. Then using their masses to farm mobs for silver (there was no balance at first and you were able to kill T7 or T8 mobs with T3 to T4 gear), to buy the gold currency at a rate of 50-150 for 1 gold (it has increased to 2000+ for 1 gold).
This allowd them to constantly own all city plots, buy out all resources in the market place and then relist those at a higher price to dominate. They were able to buy up 30%+ of all territories with their millions in silver and pushed their gatherers to T8. We had 1-3 mega alliances at all times. They did not touch each other as it would have been a waste of time. But they never missed out on killing new players on sight or abusing them as guild slaves (you could allow entry into a guild by paying a fee on top of a guild tax (90% i.e.).
The cherry on the cake was the gold system; as a dynamic currency, you were able to control the price by dumping or investing millions of gold. Some guild leaders had a pretty close connection to GMs and devs, so they waited for the moment when the developers forcefullly watered the economy down with silver, to reduce the gold price during a holiday season. GMs and or devs told players about those events and they were able to snapshot the market yet agian for more gold.

As you can see, PVP as the main design goal made life skill players fodder and slaves for zerg guilds. I watched it happen, i did interviews with guild members and got the same feedback.
We lost 95% of all playes due to those imbalances. Game went to steam, then free to play. The saddle point was reached, when 100.000+ players melted down to 10.000, then 5.000 active players and so on.
CEO left the studio, game director doubled down on pvp only mechanics and that was that.

It is a toxic game concept if not done perfectly balanced and fair. From that point of view, i am looking at new world with a lot of hope.

Sorry for the long post, this is personal topic and i actually only wanted to say that pve and life skills are a ton of fun if they serve a role and are not dominated by pvp (or pve). Three pillars, all have to work together well. Most you tubers i have watched have zero clue about that and only want pvp or viewer numbers.

Ser medieval is the only content creator i'd highly recommend following for new world. He has 1000+ hours in the game and seems to understand the system well enough.
They no longer doubled down on pvp only mechanics. PvE voices are now working to put PvP into a corner and force PvE, which doesnt exist, as the main stay. You post anything about bringing back the PvP and the PvE players down vote the shit out of your thread on the forums and their system is automated to automatically remove the post to the point where you are automatically banned. I made a post about the PvE PvP issue and it was removed, restored by staff, removed again, restored again, and finally removed and temp banned. Simply because of down votes and not breaking ANY TOS rules. Because the community, "feels" it was offensive. Even though people were posting in support. I didn't name a single person, didnt swear or target people aside from people trying to ruin the game and simply categorizing them as PvP and PvE players. Btw after all the complaining people did to remove pvp mechanics, if anyone complains about this those people simply tell them if they have problems, go play another game and stop complaining xD The community is eating itself alive. Also the population is now down to like 400.
 

Heartwood

Vice Admiral
Oct 30, 2017
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Heartwood
@DontTouchMyHoHos Thanks for the update. I do not wish to further overload the OT with Albion Online discussions, but appreciate your input.
To fix that game, it would need a wipe, a redesign of pve, old school crafting and farming skill lines, gatherer tools als weapons, gatherer dungeons, 1v1 territory areas, their avalon concept being made for 1v1 or pve with invasions, all enemy factions being made into invasion ai events (sort of like new world does it) and balance of weapons, alliance size, 1 character limit for learning points, mulitple account ban hammer, no more sponsoring by guilds and a new game director, also a new engine, as it cannot handle 100+ players in one zone and wil always suffer from being once designed as a mobile cross platformer with pc and tablet.
All of this has been posted over the years, nothing new for the forums.

And that is why New World has to deliver :).
 

DontTouchMyHoHos

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Hard to pass it up. Just have to see if all that Amazon cash has gone to good use in this game.

So … see you in beta!
It hasnt, it feels like an early access game that is still waiting to add huge content to the game. They also made a game called crucible that is literally being pulled back into closed beta from because its shit.
 
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DontTouchMyHoHos

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DontTouchMyHoHos
@DontTouchMyHoHos Thanks for the update. I do not wish to further overload the OT with Albion Online discussions, but appreciate your input.
To fix that game, it would need a wipe, a redesign of pve, old school crafting and farming skill lines, gatherer tools als weapons, gatherer dungeons, 1v1 territory areas, their avalon concept being made for 1v1 or pve with invasions, all enemy factions being made into invasion ai events (sort of like new world does it) and balance of weapons, alliance size, 1 character limit for learning points, mulitple account ban hammer, no more sponsoring by guilds and a new game director, also a new engine, as it cannot handle 100+ players in one zone and wil always suffer from being once designed as a mobile cross platformer with pc and tablet.
All of this has been posted over the years, nothing new for the forums.

And that is why New World has to deliver :).
It needs a FF14 do over. Wont be as bad since it has great graphics and what is in there works well.
 
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Talonsbane

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Im gonna drop a text bomb now.

Albion Online - a german game that did it mostly wrong is now being sort of reimagined into new world done by professionals (thank god).

Played the alpha to release, gave feedback in form of ~ 1000 posts on their forums, made it to round table and exchanged personal messages with the developers and a couple with the CEO.
The game had a ton of potential, all lost due to PVP enforcements. Over the course of 3 years, the dev team managed to first pull in players with the promise of player driven economy and pvp only to then walk back on it in favor of a pure pvp build.

We had 300+ members in our guild (Casual United) and we did farming and supply runs for pure pvp guilds. People were focused on crafting skill lines, you had to unlock every single one. There was 1 (useful) character per account and things were looking great. People whispered you if you were known for being a good crafter. Guilds had roles to fill and life skill players enjoyed bein needed and being useful.

Then they came up with Learning Points as a subscription and allowed multiple characters per account. They reduced crafting skill lines into families (swords for all 1h, 2h + special), increased farming timers from 8h to 22h, put a bottle neck on T5 resources to push people into red zones (full loot), they made most T5-T7 resources into pvp hotspots, did not limit alliances and did not regulate city plot auctions.

The result was a shit show; manipulative players throwing cash at devs to get a headstart for plots, buying most city plots, then put up a tax to remove and dominate any rival.
Crafters were not needed as you just made 3 characters, 1 pvp, 1 refining and 1 crafting alt, gave all three the sub bonus and circumvent using the market.
Farmers were left in the dust of multy account players and zerg guilds, abusing the 22h timer to put 1-3 people in charge of 150+ farming plots, creating a massive overload of horses and food, allowing their dominace to grow. Then using their masses to farm mobs for silver (there was no balance at first and you were able to kill T7 or T8 mobs with T3 to T4 gear), to buy the gold currency at a rate of 50-150 for 1 gold (it has increased to 2000+ for 1 gold).
This allowd them to constantly own all city plots, buy out all resources in the market place and then relist those at a higher price to dominate. They were able to buy up 30%+ of all territories with their millions in silver and pushed their gatherers to T8. We had 1-3 mega alliances at all times. They did not touch each other as it would have been a waste of time. But they never missed out on killing new players on sight or abusing them as guild slaves (you could allow entry into a guild by paying a fee on top of a guild tax (90% i.e.).
The cherry on the cake was the gold system; as a dynamic currency, you were able to control the price by dumping or investing millions of gold. Some guild leaders had a pretty close connection to GMs and devs, so they waited for the moment when the developers forcefullly watered the economy down with silver, to reduce the gold price during a holiday season. GMs and or devs told players about those events and they were able to snapshot the market yet agian for more gold.

As you can see, PVP as the main design goal made life skill players fodder and slaves for zerg guilds. I watched it happen, i did interviews with guild members and got the same feedback.
We lost 95% of all playes due to those imbalances. Game went to steam, then free to play. The saddle point was reached, when 100.000+ players melted down to 10.000, then 5.000 active players and so on.
CEO left the studio, game director doubled down on pvp only mechanics and that was that.

It is a toxic game concept if not done perfectly balanced and fair. From that point of view, i am looking at new world with a lot of hope.

Sorry for the long post, this is personal topic and i actually only wanted to say that pve and life skills are a ton of fun if they serve a role and are not dominated by pvp (or pve). Three pillars, all have to work together well. Most you tubers i have watched have zero clue about that and only want pvp or viewer numbers.

Ser medieval is the only content creator i'd highly recommend following for new world. He has 1000+ hours in the game and seems to understand the system well enough.
@Heartwood , I have no issues stating that in SC I have 2 accounts. My alt account was created because CIG doesn't want players to be able to teleport from place to place "Agent Smith" style & I plan on spending about 1/2 my time in game exploring the various aspects of the PU, while the rest will be hanging out in starting areas offering free lessons on whatever I've learned to new players to help them enjoy the game from the start. My alt account only currently has a C8X starter package, but when possible I'll grant him access to the ships of my main account for him to use those ships to help teach new players how to perform different tasks in game. In Dec, while I was in Vegas, I attended a local Bar Citizen event where I met several of the CIG devs & asked them what they thought of this plan of mine. They loved it & later they came out with the program that will reward backers that would also like to be that way as well as to help new players get in contact with them as mentors.

They no longer doubled down on pvp only mechanics. PvE voices are now working to put PvP into a corner and force PvE, which doesnt exist, as the main stay. You post anything about bringing back the PvP and the PvE players down vote the shit out of your thread on the forums and their system is automated to automatically remove the post to the point where you are automatically banned. I made a post about the PvE PvP issue and it was removed, restored by staff, removed again, restored again, and finally removed and temp banned. Simply because of down votes and not breaking ANY TOS rules. Because the community, "feels" it was offensive. Even though people were posting in support. I didn't name a single person, didnt swear or target people aside from people trying to ruin the game and simply categorizing them as PvP and PvE players. Btw after all the complaining people did to remove pvp mechanics, if anyone complains about this those people simply tell them if they have problems, go play another game and stop complaining xD The community is eating itself alive. Also the population is now down to like 400.
Some people need to grow a LOT of skin over their clearly exposed nerves so that they won't be triggered by anything that doesn't meet their own ideals. Also, the game allowing players to effectively get other players banned for having a different point of view on what they would like to see in regards to balancing the system towards being more fair is extreme enough to make me thankful that I never bothered getting into that title.

Can you give us your thoughts on this video then?

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l-nLCqaSM4Y
This was a pleasant eye opener into the New World game. I'm even more interested now. Thanks for sharing.
 

DontTouchMyHoHos

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DontTouchMyHoHos
Can you give us your thoughts on this video then?

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l-nLCqaSM4Y
There is only 2 magic, fire and life. Was told they have no plans to make more magic till post launch? Fishing wont be out till after the game. Dev stated "within a year". Housing is pretty much a cosmetic aside from fast travel. People are abusing the invasions since randoms not part of your faction can join and they afk so you lose. The removed the criminal system and the opt-in = no one pvps, because there is no point. There is no rewards atm for opt-in pvp. Tldr, 3 factions, crafting is a simple find node spend 20 seconds harvesting a single node. Rinse repeat. Combat is smooth but basic, dodge attack, use 1-3 abilities. There is a lot of balancing that needs to be done with it. Sword and shield can knock you down on the ground and you never get up and die. People abusing luring minions to flag people. So they need to actually make mechanics that cant be abused, seems half assed thoughts without fulling knowing how their own system will work in game. The game is tedious and a grind. The only thing worthwhile in the game atm is TW everything is essentially to feed for TW. There is no content that doesnt feed into other things only. Aside from the housing.
 
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Heartwood

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Sounds good! Better than other alphas. Thanks for the input.

Some comments:
- housing is a way to increase your effectiveness, it is not only a cosmetic feature (there are trophies). Those are part of a crafting career...
- Invasions will likely get multiple balance passes
- Flagging will increase gains, when that will happen idk but it is planned
- Gathering and crafting sound good; the gameplay loop of finding resources and production is liked by players (like me). Its called "life skills"
- Weapon balance will highly likely be a dynamic tuning throughout the game
- Minions to flag people sound like a spotted exploit/bug, not taking that too seriously
- Half ass thoughts partially agree on that. They switched 2h hammer to left handed style which likely happened due to not understanding how it should be used and/or used the spear animation base
- Grind is good for life skills. It is part of what defines market prices, as long as it still has a smooth progression.
 
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DontTouchMyHoHos

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DontTouchMyHoHos
Sounds good! Better than other alphas. Thanks for the input.

Some comments:
- housing is a way to increase your effectiveness, it is not only a cosmetic feature (there are trophies). Those are part of a crafting career...
- Invasions will likely get multiple balance passes
- Flagging will increase gains, when that will happen idk but it is planned
- Gathering and crafting sound good; the gameplay loop of finding resources and production is liked by players (like me). Its called "life skills"
- Weapon balance will highly likely be a dynamic tuning throughout the game
- Minions to flag people sound like a spotted exploit/bug, not taking that too serious
- Half ass thoughts partially agree on that. They switched 2h hammer to left handed style which likely happened due to not understanding how it should be used
- Grind is good for life skills. It is part of what defines market prices, as long as it still has a smooth progression.
The grind isnt good, there are limited nodes on the map. When they cap at 1k players there will probably never be nodes around. They are far and few in between. If they dont fix that shit its going to get very ugly for crafting and harvesting. Its a grind with very few players running around, it will become impossible with the numbers increased. Unless they add faster respawn and more timers, but being as the numbers are at its lowest ever and use to be massive a lot higher and hasnt changed, not looking like it will happen. I dont have a lot of faith in them making the right choices, their other game crucible was a shit show and thrown back into closed beta. Great ideas, heavily watered down and I feel that here too.
 
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Heartwood

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Nodes on the map - true! Had the problem in AO too. But it was a balancing thing. I.e. they pushed the spawn rate up by 300% going from one beta to the other.
Other game - Unconvinced that New World Team has anything to do with Crucible Team, but open for quotes.

Sounds like base is there, balancing is coming at the cost of players testing things out.
 
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Gambit

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The overall suggestion I got from videos is that you should level up before going full mental on gathering. Not only because your level is influence to what you get, enemies and rewards also drops resources, as well as getting access to high level areas.

Don't know about you, but I am going to play along and get stuff on the way - not the contrary :P
 
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DontTouchMyHoHos

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DontTouchMyHoHos
The overall suggestion I got from videos is that you should level up before going full mental on gathering. Not only because your level is influence to what you get, enemies and rewards also drops resources, as well as getting access to high level areas.

Don't know about you, but I am going to play along and get stuff on the way - not the contrary :P
Getting stuff along the way is simple enough. Ive been doing that.
 

Mushin

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Yeah I think the current issue is that Amazon is 0/2 for successful gaming products right now and the early buzz is saying New World has issues. Obviously anything can change, but seeing how many rapid changes they've made in the last year during Alpha tests, is not a good sign. New World has an identity crisis and that starts from the top down. I hope it all comes together, but I would recommend tempering expectations until we see what the release delivery looks like.
 
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Montoya

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Yeah I think the current issue is that Amazon is 0/2 for successful gaming products right now and the early buzz is saying New World has issues.
Here is a crazy idea, how about no more generic battle royales and medieval MMO's?

It looks like everything will flop until they come out with something original.
 
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Gambit

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It looks like everything will flop until they come out with something original.
Not sure if a great navigations era fantasy is refreshing, but the game as whole kinda is. Not because the idea is original (it reminds me so much of for honor), but we really lack some finished and new, action / exploration / mmo / rpg right now.

You have some really old ones that people are already burned out. Some that are in production without a release date. And then you have New World with the foundations ready to begin soon and with a heavy focus on content expansion. By no means I expect this game to be the cyberpunk / Star citizen of multiplayer, but I can see myself easily having hundreds of hours chilling out on it.

That is enough for me, really.
 
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DontTouchMyHoHos

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DontTouchMyHoHos
Yeah I think the current issue is that Amazon is 0/2 for successful gaming products right now and the early buzz is saying New World has issues. Obviously anything can change, but seeing how many rapid changes they've made in the last year during Alpha tests, is not a good sign. New World has an identity crisis and that starts from the top down. I hope it all comes together, but I would recommend tempering expectations until we see what the release delivery looks like.
It is yet to be seen if NW is a failure, but we shall see. We havent seen everything
Here is a crazy idea, how about no more generic battle royales and medieval MMO's?

It looks like everything will flop until they come out with something original.
I think the issue isnt really that they are making them. Its okay you have a BR what are you offering that they are not and is it enough for me to abandon my friends, time, and money to change to your game. People who play those games have hundreds of hours and have attached themself to that game. Its not like some of them are bad games, its just those games dont offer enough for you to say fuck it. People dont have time to invest into multiple games of the same genre, so they pick 1 game and stick to that until something superior comes along. In the instance of pve, why would I invest time into New World for PvE when FF14 exists that is superior in every way for pve content compared to what new world is. At launch and AFTER the remake the ff14 mmo offered better content and more then new world and new world is like 10% of the content ff14 has at launch. So the only thing to grab me to New World is PvP. What does it have? opt-in pvp and TW. So you have to grind to the end of the game just to experience it and be worthwhile. In terms pvp games there are a bunch of superior games to play for pvp in this instance. So then I have to look for what makes it different. Its medieval that is about it. I can dive farther, but you know the rest of my opinion. It's not like I hated this game from the getcko, I was super excited about this game, but they kept removing mechanics instead of just making them work. I.E Open World pvp, ark like buildling etc.
 
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Mushin

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It is yet to be seen if NW is a failure, but we shall see. We havent seen everything
Im thinking the last two major releases, Crucible and The Grand Tour Game, also Breakaway, which was cancelled. So 0/2 successful products and a product that was cancelled due to lack of interest. The Grand Tour game was released which was a positive.
 
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