Ship showdown predictions?

[NaffNaffBobFace]

So, CIG just posted the ship battle totals of the final 4 ships battles in the tournament. It turns out, that while the AC might have edged past the MSR in the end, the MSR received 3,218 more votes combined during the tournament. So as far as I'm concerned, the MSR is the real champ by the numbers, not just the slight loss in the final fight.

I wonder what the grand totals for previois years have been? I bet the Catapillar from 2949 didn't get as many total votes as some of the other contenders...

Could some of the loosers from Round Two have even got more total votes than some of the top 4?

 

[maynard]

[the Argo] also can't quantum between anything long distance like between a planet & its moons or between planets ...

I was trying to sound wise but you revealed my ignorance to all the world

damn you, Talonsbane!

 

[Talonsbane]

I was trying to sound wise but you revealed my ignorance to all the world

damn you, Talonsbane!

Actually, your advice about having the multiple accounts very well might be genius advice depending on how things turn out in the future.

 

[Talonsbane]

I wonder what the grand totals for previois years have been? I bet the Catapillar from 2949 didn't get as many total votes as some of the other contenders...

Could some of the loosers from Round Two have even got more total votes than some of the top 4?

While some of a previous years round 2 might have surpassed the total votes gained at that point compared to those of their rival when they lost, It's difficult to imagine that they would've still out scored them after the next round unless they drew massive numbers the 1st couple rounds, but their bracket rivals in round 3 barely got their & didn't have much push behind them except to just barely get them to the next round.

I was pleasantly surprised by how competitive the majority of the battles were, even if I'm not a fan of the overall outcome.

 

[Shadow Reaper]

Thank you for your years of experience in Tech Philosophy. Would you be accepting that your analysis of this situation, that voting for the Argo being either troll or collusion with troll activity and needs to be called out on that, is over-generalising?

No. My contention is that the ARGO is not the "favorite flyable" ship of anyone. Voting for it was thus intended as a bad joke that makes a mockery of the competition.

As to the argument that some people can't afford expensive ships like the Carrack, please note that Carracks need crew members and many players with humble means fly crew on Carracks, MSRs and C2s. My argument is that NO ONE finds the ARGO their "favorite" in any way. Seems obvious to me and the length to which people make up hypotheticals and other verbal gymnastics to the contrary is disillusioning. If you want to check my hypothesis, you can try to take a poll of those who have crewed the most popular ships (Carrack MSR and C2) and those who have ever flown the ARGO, but you can use some common sense here as well. Does anyone here believe players spend significant time flying the ARGO in the sheer numbers they crew or pilot the Carrack? No one is stupid enough to believe that.

No one in their right mind thinks the ARGO their "favorite" in any way. People who voted for it were not voting for their favorite, but rather trolling the competition, and if you refuse to sanction or deter troll behavior, that will come back and bite you on the ass. I would not presume we'll ever see such a competition again. Were it my call certainly the competition would be over, since it obviously is dominated by trolls.

 

[NaffNaffBobFace]

No. My contention is that the ARGO is not the "favorite flyable" ship of anyone. Voting for it was thus intended as a bad joke that makes a mockery of the competition.

As to the argument that some people can't afford expensive ships like the Carrack, please note that Carracks need crew members and many players with humble means fly crew on Carracks, MSRs and C2s. My argument is that NO ONE finds the ARGO their "favorite" in any way. Seems obvious to me and the length to which people make up hypotheticals and other verbal gymnastics to the contrary is disillusioning. If you want to check my hypothesis, you can try to take a poll of those who have crewed the most popular ships (Carrack MSR and C2) and those who have ever flown the ARGO, but you can use some common sense here as well. Does anyone here believe players spend significant time flying the ARGO in the sheer numbers they crew or pilot the Carrack? No one is stupid enough to believe that.

No one in their right mind thinks the ARGO their "favorite" in any way. People who voted for it were not voting for their favorite, but rather trolling the competition, and if you refuse to sanction or deter troll behavior, that will come back and bite you on the ass. I would not presume we'll ever see such a competition again. Were it my call certainly the competition would be over, since it obviously is dominated by trolls.

Please see my second point from that post:

"With a option of A or B there will be always be more people either with a negative or neutral opinion of both of the options than a positive for one or the other, and they would need little convincing to choose one over the other. Left without any external influence they might use their own criteria such as affordability or capability but if they don't care a damn about either option and a friendly face says 'sir/ma'am, please lend me your vote' there is a chance they will because if they don't care either way and there is no consequence, why not help someone out who does care?"

I can tell you the above happened at least once because it happened to me. I was neutral on the Argo/Carrak battle, didn't give a damn about either of them.

The Carrak is so out of my pocket I don't even think about it, think of it as you looking for a second hand car and starting by looking up the prices of used 747 passenger aircraft.

The Argo has no QD capability so as someone who wants to go walk-about in the 'Verse it's like having a bicycle when one needs a boat.

But the Argo support was all like "#VoteArgo", so I did because they actually tried to get people enthusiastic about their tub. The Carrak assumed greatness forgetting not everyone had access to witness its greatness. Was I supporting trolls? Nope not as far as I am aware, none of the Argo supporters said "Rah rah rah, help us smash the oiks!" they said here's our favourite ship please vote for it.

To put this another way, if we as TEST ever got our act in gear and got the mighty Aurora in the top 16 vote (you have to submit arts and crafts etc), whenever a ship which I didn't give a ropey toss about was up against it, I'd vote Aurora for the GLORY of TEST! Would that be trolling? Nope it would be voting for and supporting our Org Mascot.

 

[Shadow Reaper]

I think you're playing a semantics game. You're hypothisizing people made up their own criteria and are thus justified in shitting all over the intention of the contest. Sorry, that's not okay. That's trolling. Neither of us are in a position to psychoanalyze why any one person participated in trolling, but it is certainly trolling to deliberately thwart the intention of the contest. You understand, guessing about motives makes no difference at all. If I understand you, your argument is basically given the proper motives, trolling is okay.

No, it is not.

Stop making excuses for these people. They're trolls and the only proper response to trolling is some form of deterrence. Players who pad crash have excuses for their behavior. We are not meant to care about their bullshit excuses. The ONLY proper response to trolling is deterrence.

 

[Lorddarthvik]

I think you're playing a semantics game. You're hypothisizing people made up their own criteria and are thus justified in shitting all over the intention of the contest. Sorry, that's not okay. That's trolling. Neither of us are in a position to psychoanalyze why any one person participated in trolling, but it is certainly trolling to deliberately thwart the intention of the contest. You understand, guessing about motives makes no difference at all. If I understand you, your argument is basically given the proper motives, trolling is okay.

No, it is not.

Stop making excuses for these people. They're trolls and the only proper response to trolling is some form of deterrence. Players who pad crash have excuses for their behavior. We are not meant to care about their bullshit excuses. The ONLY proper response to trolling is deterrence.

You are the one making up the intentions of the contest, and the intentions of the participants as well. You made up the rules for yourself that you have to vote for your favorite to fly ship, or the objectively better ship, I don't care which one it was. It's your rules and yours ONLY. Undersrtand this, and you might understand why your "every Argo voter is a chaotic evil troll" argument holds no water at all.

The intention of the contest was whatever the hell you want it to be. Yes, you are exactly right, people made up their own criteria for how they wanted to vote because they could!
Again, this is not real life. it's a video game on the internet. People can actually make a difference between the two, more often than you make it out to be.

Out of a Carrack vs Argo I will always vote Argo. The same reason as @NaffNaffBobFace . I couldn't give a shit about how much you or anyone else likes the Carrack, or how very utterly awesome it is on paper. And yes I've flown it with a couple of friends during the Ship Expo and I didn't like it. I like small Single seater ships. That's me. I'm allowed to vote for what I like, not what you like. I'm not actually harming you in any way by doing so, even if you have the very false belief that I do. . So I will vote for whatever I like. Am I a chaotic evil person now?
To you, maybe I am, but to me, you are whatever DnD name Tyrant falls under because you are trying to force me not to vote for what I like, but for whatever you feel like is the correct answer, when there isn't one.

 

[NaffNaffBobFace]

I think you're playing a semantics game. You're hypothisizing people made up their own criteria and are thus justified in shitting all over the intention of the contest. Sorry, that's not okay. That's trolling. Neither of us are in a position to psychoanalyze why any one person participated in trolling, but it is certainly trolling to deliberately thwart the intention of the contest. You understand, guessing about motives makes no difference at all. If I understand you, your argument is basically given the proper motives, trolling is okay.

No, it is not.

Stop making excuses for these people. They're trolls and the only proper response to trolling is some form of deterrence. Players who pad crash have excuses for their behavior. We are not meant to care about their bullshit excuses. The ONLY proper response to trolling is deterrence.

Thanks for your angle on it. Your take on trolls in general is not incorrect and I am not trying to cover for or make excuses for trolling (I don't agree with the word 'trolling' in the first place. Don't pretty it up, call it what it is - Harassment) however I still don't think calling the voting blanket trolling takes in to account a lot of the complexities around the BIS contest and voting, including the sociology and psychology of it all.

Perhaps the only way we'll be able to call this one way or another is to get the mighty Aurora in to the BIS next year. If we can get it into the top 16 and past the first round of voting without any trolling - Just good old fashioned enthusiasm for TESTs mascot ship, that may prove it one way or another.

 

[Bambooza]

Out of a Carrack vs Argo I will always vote Argo. The same reason as @NaffNaffBobFace . I couldn't give a shit about how much you or anyone else likes the Carrack, or how very utterly awesome it is on paper. And yes I've flown it with a couple of friends during the Ship Expo and I didn't like it. I like small Single seater ships. That's me. I'm allowed to vote for what I like, not what you like. I'm not actually harming you in any way by doing so, even if you have the very false belief that I do. . So I will vote for whatever I like. Am I a chaotic evil person now?
To you, maybe I am, but to me, you are whatever DnD name Tyrant falls under because you are trying to force me not to vote for what I like, but for whatever you feel like is the correct answer, when there isn't one.

Yes, yes you are. Voting against the Carrack how dare you!. Carrack is love Carrack is life.

But in all honesty, I am glad that not everyone is going for the same ship it means CIG is doing what they need to do to make all ships viable in the game and not a linear progression to a raid set of gear. That it matters more on what your skill sets are what you want to accomplish and what cash on hand and reputation you have as to what you can do not what ship you have grinded towards. And yes the Argo does have a place in the verse and I imagine as physicalized inventory and cargo movement becomes more pronounced its role will be fully realized as both a short-range cargo hauler and people transport. After all, both the Javelin and I believe Kraken have bespoke Argo hangers.

So while you still are a chaotic evil person more sinister than the Joker I am glad you have ships that you would rather fly as it means the verse is diverse and the game is realizing its dream.