SidAlpha responds to Montoya

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by sovapid, Jul 11, 2018 at 8:37 PM.

  1. sovapid

    sovapid Commander

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  2. NaffNaffBobFace

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  3. Black Sunder

    Black Sunder Rock Raiders
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  4. CosmicTrader

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    Yes, That is a good video.
     
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  5. NaffNaffBobFace

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    Well, hats off to Sidney Alpha, he was delightfully reasonable. Excellent stuff, thumbs up.

    If I were to be critical:

    I would say the amount of "if" in the middle part of the video still reveals unsubstantiated opinion - At the beginning of the vid, Sidney gave a great speech about wanting to put real information infront of eyes, I feel his desire to do that and know he believes in it... but then went on to provide "ifs", "buts" and unfounded opinion in certain parts. Opinion is great - until its countered with facts. The only strength the opinions about funding levels have is that this is something we're not going to get any facts about for years, if at all. I appreciate the opinion from another angle - but unless it can be substantiated it's not putting facts in front of eyes. That said i'm not saying people are not allowed to provide their opinion, just don't fly it under a flag of fact.

    Also, in regard to greed and the price of ships: you are not buying anything. Look in the Terms Of Service. Look at the checkbox in the checkout. You are funding the game and getting a ship as a thanks, every pledge is just that - a pledge, not a purchase. You are not buying a ship, no ship in the game is going to be worth even $150. Failure to perform due diligence leaves you open to people like me vaporising your point with simple, undeniable facts... as I originally suggested in the thread made by Montoya in his response video to the original video, do due-diligence, read the Terms Of Service, understand what your funds are and what is being paid for and what it is being used for, and don't build your castle on a foundation of sand.

    But as I'm not being critical:

    Excellent stuff thanks for not turning it into one big flame-war :slight_smile:
     
    #5 NaffNaffBobFace, Jul 11, 2018 at 9:26 PM
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018 at 9:48 PM
  6. Montoya

    Montoya Administrator
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    Nice vid!

    So lets open this up, what points do you feel should be debated and elaborated upon?
     
  7. Wolfy

    Wolfy Space Kitty

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    I got all the space plants... that is all I have to say.
     
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  8. sovapid

    sovapid Commander

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    The biggest issue is, as he said in the video, he is coming in from a 30,000 foot level. But at the same time talking about detailed things which he can't understand/have a full grasp of what is going on from that 30,000 foot level.
     
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  9. Doyzer

    Doyzer Vice Admiral
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    Just because CIG doesn't show much SQ42 doesn't mean they aren't working on it. I imagine more people are working on SQ42 versus the PU.
     
  10. Bambooza

    Bambooza Vice Admiral

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    Not only that the closer they get to its release the less they can show us with out spoiling the surprise.
     
  11. Harkonan

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    I don't think I disagree with anything in that video honestly.

    Though my feeling on the whole "greed" issue is that people have the freedom to spend their money however they want. Some people blow hundreds of thousands of dollars in Vegas on any given weekend ... it's their choice.

    By definition, is offering more and more pledge amounts greedy? I think so.
    Would CIG be stupid not to offer it when people are willing? I think so.
     
    #11 Harkonan, Jul 12, 2018 at 12:21 AM
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2018 at 12:43 AM
  12. Montoya

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    Defending Star Citizen is to do so from a position of weakness.

    We are the underdogs here.

    We have to happily eat shit for a while longer until we get 3.4 or what ever patch that gives us 60fps.

    When ever they get their procedural tech down and can spit out solar systems on the fly, then we have our day in the sun.

    Until then we to play defense.
     
  13. Harkonan

    Harkonan Vice Admiral
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    I don't feel the need to defend Star Citizen. I spent my hard earned money on it ... no one elses. People can stay the hell out of my business ... I don't care what they think.

    Star Citizen could crash and burn along with my money. That would be a sad day, but I KNOW that is a possibility I'm willing to live with.
    Star Citizen could become one of the most enjoyable and beautiful games I ever played. That would be a great day and I would feel great that I had a little part in financially developing the game. (Remember, WE ARE the "publisher". It is OUR job to hold CIGs feet to the fire.)

    Either way ... no one is putting a gun to my head and telling me I have to pledge or play the game. All this venom and animosity we see on either side is frankly, childish and stupid.

    Pledge ... don't pledge.
    Play ... don't play.
    And we all go about our lives either way.
     
  14. Montoya

    Montoya Administrator
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    That was my attitude too until people started accusing me of being on the CIG payroll for being neutral! :smile:
     
  15. SullyQuindarius

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  16. Tealwraith

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    I have a buddy that takes a trip to Vegas every year for the PBR championships, or something with bull riding. He says the trip sets him back $1600-$1700 every year. I asked him what does he have to show for it? He said it was fun and he enjoys it. I have another buddy who buys $10 in lotto tickets every week and more when the amount goes above $100 million. He says that he gets a chance to win and has fun dreaming all week about what he'll do with the money. I guess I should make a video condemning these guys as idiots who are getting scammed by the lottery and vacation industries.
     
  17. Hybus

    Hybus Commander
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    I would like to see a little more transparency with SQ42, they don't have to hash out the story or youtube some play throughs. But I would like to see something, even if it was just engineering reports or technical numbers.
     
  18. Montoya

    Montoya Administrator
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    They better give us a massive reveal at Citizencon or I will make an angry video!
     
  19. DirectorGunner

    DirectorGunner Grand Admiral
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    I recognize that after effects template he used :P

    I dunno what else to comment about, lol... halfway through his video

    edit:
    12 minutes in... he's under the impression the kickstarter responses of hitting stretch goals meant that reserves were made are enough to fund the game now.. the problem is he's not acknowledging enough to fact that not only the scope of the game has expanded... but the employee base has massively expanded. I don't know if Sid has any experience with budgets concerning many employees like say in show business or corporate world. But... the more employees you have, your costs skyrocket.... well past MILLIONS annually... people forget how hugely funding demands scales when you hire on more staff.

    He also is going after the publisher aspect of the discussion.

    He does have an interesting argument about CIG being "greedy"... have to define business and how that shouldn't be personified.

    "Would not have gone all in....." The assumptions he makes on what a company would do or not do is very idealistic and not very grounded imo.
     
    #19 DirectorGunner, Jul 12, 2018 at 2:53 AM
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2018 at 3:17 AM
  20. Mich Angel

    Mich Angel Grand Admiral
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    Good video from SidAlpha nice to see...
    Show on good character to admit having been wrong and stand up for own beliefs.


    I still don't understand why so many like almost all talking about how much money this and that and how long this and that.. etc..
    It seem like it's very convenient to overlook and make it easier to act out toward CiG in the following part....... They reach the original stretch goal and could start building on that, but realized tech gotten a lot lot better since they started that open up a lot of new possibilities they didn't even think about earlier ( sure might been on drawing board ) so what did they do...

    They asked us backer if they should go with the stretch goal they reach or make it even better
    ( we have this, but we can do this )
    As far as I remember, backers response was... mm.. oh wow... okay we're in let's go, do it!
    "make it "the best damn space game ever.." <-that line, they are still using after that.

    So what would you done in their situation suddenly you truly get the chance to build your dream game, all the way, not half way.
    Would you say no to that. ( I know I wouldn't )

    They responded by say okay we can do this, it will take longer and ship will start cost more and more as we grow so with that said.
    "let's build "the best damn space game ever." <---
    (And they repeatedly said this many time on many occasions since then, "remember" or "don't forget", ships will cost more as it grow.)

    Why is it so har to talk about this part in same sentences as the money and time management paj throwing that happen back and forth..

    Don't anyone understand that the majority of backers would start to make a lot of noise if they don't like where it's going??

    ( No don't bother ask me for prof, anyone that want to find it can do their own research and digging in the old Youtube clip twitch, twitter etc.. etc.. it's all there )

    CHEERS! :beers: :beer: :beers: :beer::beers: :beer::beers: :beer:

    Side note:
    I knew what I got in to.
    I have no misguided illusions.
    I know it might fail and sure I'll be sad but not broken.
    I know it might succeed and be what we hope it to be.
    The best damn space game ever.
    Only time can tell... I am okay with either of that or I shouldn't be here.!


    If any of the yellow text above is something any one in a project can not agree, accept or stand by.
    It's high time to leave, back of and focus on something else for a wile, clear the head as some call it.
    Then come back much later and if feeling is still the same it's a easy choice, the door is that way..--->


    :beers: :beer: :beers:
     
    #20 Mich Angel, Jul 12, 2018 at 2:58 AM
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2018 at 3:05 AM

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