Zeus vs. Cutlass

[Richard Bong]

Lookjng, particularily at the Cutlass Blue compared to the Zeus MR.

I know the nerf bat hasn't hit the Zeus yet. I also know the MR isn't flyable yet.

I'm more looking for first impressions on the Zeus compared to the Cutlas Blue, in particular speed and agility.

I know the Zeus has a crew of 3 vs. 2. I know the Zeus has both a QED and an EMP.

If the Zeus can't keep up, though, the EMP and QED are pretty useless.

I know, get both, but it seems pretty redundant, like having both an Avenger Stalker and a Hawk.

 

[Dirtbag_Leader]

Based on my experience with the Zeus ES *so far,* it fits the general CIG progress where it's a much NICER ship (being newer) and perhaps a slightly more capable ship too, but you'll NEVER get that Drake 'bang-for-your-buck' that you do on the Cutlass. . . Not sure if that helps or not.

 

[Aramsolari]

I've long since given up on trying to get a ship based on what it CAN do in the future. Current stats don't seem to matter since CIG wields the buff/nerf bat quite liberally. Super Hornet, Ares Inferno/Ion, Corsair, etc, etc.

Imma getting them ships for the looks these days. I also got the Zeus cause it has a toilet. I don't wanna have to fling open the door on a Cutlass while in Quantum so I can empty out the bucket!

 

[BUTUZ]

Like the freelancer the cutlass is old and very out of date.

That being said I just melted my Zeus CL as I prefer my Connie Taurus

 

[Mudhawk]

Well, basically the comparisions based on flight models are a little off because (right now at least) all Cutlasses fly the same while all Zeus MKIIs don't.
Point being that I can't tell what the Marque will fly like based on the Clipper flight model. I would assume though that like the Blue, the Marque will have and I cite an independent source "..a cop motor, a 440-cubic-inch plant. It's got cop tires, cop suspension, cop shocks. It's a model made before the catalytic converter so it'll run good on regular gas..."
Personally I believe that the Marque will be the better ship for a team of 3. (Guess the pilot can't EMP or QI/QD, right?)
And the good old Blue is the better ship for solo headhunting.
So both are valid choices.

I don't wanna have to fling open the door on a Cutlass while in Quantum so I can empty out the bucket!

That's why I consider the Cutlass Red the best ship of the lot. Med Bed, Scanner, and a shower/loo combo. Perfect!

Like the freelancer the cutlass is old and very out of date.

Oi, the Freelancer and the Cutlass we fly right now ARE the reworked and update versions.
Remember these babies?
Maybe from your Garage Days...?

(Please do note the central mounted repeater under the cockpit of the Cutlass. )

 

[BUTUZ]

Well, basically the comparisions based on flight models are a little off because (right now at least) all Cutlasses fly the same while all Zeus MKIIs don't.
Point being that I can't tell what the Marque will fly like based on the Clipper flight model. I would assume though that like the Blue, the Marque will have and I cite an independent source "..a cop motor, a 440-cubic-inch plant. It's got cop tires, cop suspension, cop shocks. It's a model made before the catalytic converter so it'll run good on regular gas..."
Personally I believe that the Marque will be the better ship for a team of 3. (Guess the pilot can't EMP or QI/QD, right?)
And the good old Blue is the better ship for solo headhunting.
So both are valid choices.


That's why I consider the Cutlass Red the best ship of the lot. Med Bed, Scanner, and a shower/loo combo. Perfect!




Oi, the Freelancer and the Cutlass we fly right now ARE the reworked and update versions.
Remember these babies?
Maybe from your Garage Days...?
View attachment 26080

View attachment 26081

(Please do note the central mounted repeater under the cockpit of the Cutlass. )

Ooh baby look at the 4 x S4 canons on that freelancer. Come to daddy my trigger finger is itching!

Sadly both were reworked quite a while ago and as CIG has shown lately 6 months in ship building skill makes a hell o fa difference. The ones coming out now are absolute beauties in terms of crafting regardless of if you like the brand or model.

 

[Ayeteeone]

If the Zeus can't keep up, though, the EMP and QED are pretty useless.

I know, get both, but it seems pretty redundant, like having both an Avenger Stalker and a Hawk.

These are good questions to ask IMO, and I'm not sure there is a good answer right now. Speculation is free though :)

Blue has better speed and maneuvering than either the ES or CL. For the MR to compete at in-flight takedowns it'll need more aggressive tuning than it's brothers, which is not a big ask.

Anecdotally, I've gotten a couple of PvP kills in the ES, a Titan and a Gladius that jumped me. Not the smartest flying on their part, but their buddies did take me out. Might have gotten more but the turret bugged out so the guy in that seat wasn't able to contribute. IF turret gameplay ever 'gets good', the MR has a distinct advantage over the Blue for team play. The other guy might be out of range but he's never out of the line of sight.

Internally, the Blue obviously has more cells. I dunno what situations they were considering with 12 pods, maybe 'Frontier' operations where it makes more sense to turn the bounties in later. If you want to risk that. In most other respects the Zeus offers more. Suit lockers, dedicated armory, 3 egress methods (including access to the upper hull), component redundancy for improved survivability, and amenities for survival and npc needs.

I think we need to see what the capture loop looks like before one will show a clear advantage over the other, and of course it's not obvious yet what impact the changes to bed logging and survival mechanics will have on play.

 

[Shadow Reaper]

I doubt any of the Zeus clan will ever match the speed and agility of the Cutty, but I doubt that’s the metric you really need to decide between. You need an extra gunner for the MR. How many players do you have? Also if you’re concerned with corraling, stick a Fury or two in the back. Now you need more players, but the MR is likely your fastest 5 player whip.

Personally I hate Cutties and love the MR. Walk in closet, er; I mean armory. Gotta love that. In normal play it is going to feel all bad ass, whereas Cutties feel like a 1974 Chevy conversion van with a cigar box holding a 1911 pistol.

Gotta go RSI.

 

[Richard Bong]

These are good questions to ask IMO, and I'm not sure there is a good answer right now. Speculation is free though :)

Blue has better speed and maneuvering than either the ES or CL. For the MR to compete at in-flight takedowns it'll need more aggressive tuning than it's brothers, which is not a big ask.

Anecdotally, I've gotten a couple of PvP kills in the ES, a Titan and a Gladius that jumped me. Not the smartest flying on their part, but their buddies did take me out. Might have gotten more but the turret bugged out so the guy in that seat wasn't able to contribute. IF turret gameplay ever 'gets good', the MR has a distinct advantage over the Blue for team play. The other guy might be out of range but he's never out of the line of sight.

Internally, the Blue obviously has more cells. I dunno what situations they were considering with 12 pods, maybe 'Frontier' operations where it makes more sense to turn the bounties in later. If you want to risk that. In most other respects the Zeus offers more. Suit lockers, dedicated armory, 3 egress methods (including access to the upper hull), component redundancy for improved survivability, and amenities for survival and npc needs.

I think we need to see what the capture loop looks like before one will show a clear advantage over the other, and of course it's not obvious yet what impact the changes to bed logging and survival mechanics will have on play.

They're both supposed to have 12 cells. As for why you might need that many? We already have bounties with 3 criminals on them. That number could go up. And if your bounties are in Pyro or Levski, you're going to have to get back to UEE space to turn the targets in. It might be a good idea to catch several before returning.

The Blue does have a dedicated Armory, in addition to the weapon racks in the crew area, and, at least, one dedicated Armor locker.

Based on my experience with the Zeus ES *so far,* it fits the general CIG progress where it's a much NICER ship (being newer) and perhaps a slightly more capable ship too, but you'll NEVER get that Drake 'bang-for-your-buck' that you do on the Cutlass. . . Not sure if that helps or not.

Thanks. Though, in real world money it's a $15 difference. :) Does bang for the buck really apply?

Imma getting them ships for the looks these days. I also got the Zeus cause it has a toilet. I don't wanna have to fling open the door on a Cutlass while in Quantum so I can empty out the bucket!

The Cutlass is supposed to be getting a head.
We shall see.

 

[Richard Bong]

I doubt any of the Zeus clan will ever match the speed and agility of the Cutty, but I doubt that’s the metric you really need to decide between. You need an extra gunner for the MR. How many players do you have? Also if you’re concerned with corraling, stick a Fury or two in the back. Now you need more players, but the MR is likely your fastest 5 player whip.

Personally I hate Cutties and love the MR. Walk in closet, er; I mean armory. Gotta love that. In normal play it is going to feel all bad ass, whereas Cutties feel like a 1974 Chevy conversion van with a cigar box holding a 1911 pistol.

Gotta go RSI.

Have you been in a Blue? The armory on the Blue is, in addition to the weapon racks in the crew area, in the same section as the prisoner capsules. Complete with an armor locker. Behind a steel cage. Very Razorcrest like.

 

[Mudhawk]

I dunno what situations they were considering with 12 pods, maybe 'Frontier' operations where it makes more sense to turn the bounties in later.

This is a Drake ship. Are you asuming all applications of this ships capabilities will be lawful?
From kidnapping to slavery to organ trade... Oh well, you get the idea, right?

whereas Cutties feel like a 1974 Chevy conversion van with a cigar box holding a 1911 pistol.

Ah! That brings a tear of joy to my eye. What a beautiful depiction of the essential charme of this unique vessel.
Make me what to buy another one just for the heck of it.

The Cutlass is supposed to be getting a head.

Well, if the ever do a Cutlass MKII, all they need to do is make the turret a remotely controlled one and keep the shower/loo combo from the RED.
I'd love them to make the power and shield systems redundant, but that would actually contradict the corporate identity of Drake.
I'd also love the belly gun of the original concept. Instead of the two winglet mounted S3s maybe?
Oh, and move that horizontal strut in windshield a little lower or a lot highter.
You know witch one I'm talking about...

PS:
I'd also like to mention that the Blue actually has the better view from the cockpit than the Zeus.
It's got the better vibes.
It's got the same amount of egress points though more or less only one ingress point (except in EVA).
It sadly does lack the loo. Good thing that mechanic holds no meaning yet...
Final verdict will be out once I tested if I can fit a Nursa in there too.
It did fit the ES after all.
Try THAT with a Cutlass...

 

[Ayeteeone]

They're both supposed to have 12 cells. As for why you might need that many? We already have bounties with 3 criminals on them. That number could go up. And if your bounties are in Pyro or Levski, you're going to have to get back to UEE space to turn the targets in. It might be a good idea to catch several before returning.

The Blue does have a dedicated Armory, in addition to the weapon racks in the crew area, and, at least, one dedicated Armor locker.

Roger that, I might have missed the number of pods the MR carries. I have both and am looking forward to doing in-use comparisons.

This is a Drake ship. Are you asuming all applications of this ships capabilities will be lawful?
From kidnapping to slavery to organ trade... Oh well, you get the idea, right?

In it's base form it's a garishly decorated cop car. Not subtle, and screams "Pirate ME!" as loudly as any cargo ship in the verse. That won't keep it from being useful, especially with a different paint and the lights turned off. For the kind of work you are implying though, I'd prefer low-key, and am quite certain that the pods will be useful in most ships that they fit in. An example that's not a hard stretch is the 300i. It was sold in a Bounty Hunter package way back in the day; that 8 SCU bay underneath looks easily big enough for a prisoner pod.

Again, until we see the game loop fleshed out, the best we can do is a S.W.A.G.

 

[Richard Bong]

Roger that, I might have missed the number of pods the MR carries. I have both and am looking forward to doing in-use comparisons.



In it's base form it's a garishly decorated cop car. Not subtle, and screams "Pirate ME!" as loudly as any cargo ship in the verse. That won't keep it from being useful, especially with a different paint and the lights turned off. For the kind of work you are implying though, I'd prefer low-key, and am quite certain that the pods will be useful in most ships that they fit in. An example that's not a hard stretch is the 300i. It was sold in a Bounty Hunter package way back in the day; that 8 SCU bay underneath looks easily big enough for a prisoner pod.

Again, until we see the game loop fleshed out, the best we can do is a S.W.A.G.

When you think handsome Bounty Hunter making his way through a galaxy of enemies, you think Constellation. :)

 

[Mudhawk]

When you think handsome Bounty Hunter making his way through a galaxy of enemies, you think Constellation. :)

And here some people worried about beeing fast enough in a Zeus MKII.
If you can do it in a Conny then speed can't be the deciding faczor. ;-P

 

[Richard Bong]

And here some people worried about beeing fast enough in a Zeus MKII.
If you can do it in a Conny then speed can't be the deciding faczor. ;-P

That is the CIG marketing material for the Constellation Andromeda. :) And is still on the sales page.

They also, originally, talked about the back seat in a Super Hornet as suitable for carrying a Bounty. Based on the Hawk bounty compartment rework, and what they have shown as part of the plan for live prisoners, it needs pods. When talking about the MR they mentioned that pods could go on the cargo grid but couldn't be stacked.

So, yes, the 300 series should be useable, as well as the Connie, or any other cargo hauler with an internal bay that the pod fits in, to include the Redeemer, without a module. The Hornet series, not so much.

 

[Mudhawk]

So, yes, the 300 series should be useable, as well as the Connie, or any other cargo hauler with an internal bay that the pod fits in, to include the Redeemer, without a module.

Fascinating! (To quote one of my favorite Science Officers)
Actually, it makes me wonder if those pods can be used on players.
If so, can those players free themselves by logging out?
Or is that locked down for an hour or so?
If so, how many guys will shut down other players just for "fun"?
So many questions, not enough relation to the original topic.
Once again, allez le Bleu!
I simply like Drake ships.

 

[Shadow Reaper]

Actually, it makes me wonder if those pods can be used on players.
If so, can those players free themselves by logging out?

No, you cannot free yourself by logging out. What CIG said about this years ago was that bounty hunters will need to be limited by how long they can keep their prey in a box, but that it will be longer than most prison sentences. So criminal behavior will be much more seriously mitigated by fear of lockup, and hunters will have a strong sense of reward for their efforts. It is the bounty hunters’ big stick everyone will learn to fear and respect. It’s much more effort to live capture than to kill, and there is both financial reward for this as well as prestige.

So don’t piss off guys like Richard Bong. He’ll put you in the stink house.

 

[Richard Bong]

No, you cannot free yourself by logging out. What CIG said about this years ago was that bounty hunters will need to be limited by how long they can keep their prey in a box, but that it will be longer than most prison sentences. So criminal behavior will be much more seriously mitigated by fear of lockup, and hunters will have a strong sense of reward for their efforts. It is the bounty hunters’ big stick everyone will learn to fear and respect. It’s much more effort to live capture than to kill, and there is both financial reward for this as well as prestige.

So don’t piss off guys like Richard Bong. He’ll put you in the stink house.

There was a suggestion, by CIG, that if you were captured, you could either wait for the pod to be delivered, or accept the capture and skip to the prison sentence (similar to waiting for medical rescue or respawning in the hospital). The person in the pod would be switched to an NPC so the hunter could turn them in for mission completion.

Whether that mechanic changes or not, nobody (likely not even at CIG), knows what "Bounty Hunting V2" will actually look like.

 

[Richard Bong]

Fascinating! (To quote one of my favorite Science Officers)
Actually, it makes me wonder if those pods can be used on players.
If so, can those players free themselves by logging out?
Or is that locked down for an hour or so?
If so, how many guys will shut down other players just for "fun"?
So many questions, not enough relation to the original topic.
Once again, allez le Bleu!
I simply like Drake ships.

See my response to @Shadow Reaper on log out or escape. The short answer is no.

The pods will be used to bring in live bounties, regardless if they are NPC or PC.

 

[Mudhawk]

The pods will be used to bring in live bounties, regardless if they are NPC or PC.

Well, to me the big question is if they work wether the "victim" has a crimestat or not.
Because there are weiiiird, creepy people out there with rather distasteful fetishes.
And some things they do "just for fun" or "roleplaying" are a bit questionable.
So if we get game mechanics for locking people up I don't just test them based on their use but on their possible abuse.

But I agree, even CIG probably is still up in the air about how to implement Bounty Hunting for good.
They better get their nickers straight though after selling that many Bounty Hunter ships already.
It's not like they don't know exactly what we're all fantazising about...