Coronavirus COVID-19 Thread

[Vavrik]

@NaffNaffBobFace @Montoya @Aramsolari
By the way... I hate msnbc and axios but at least I try to give you info you'll read.

I read a lot of what you post, I don't listen to FOX or CNN if I can help it, but I get a lot of news from BBC, CBC, CTV etc, and local news. Life works better that way for me. I find most US media to be way more partisan than I like.

As for Covid19 related data, I'm looking mostly at the John Hopkins Coronavirus Resource Center and good old Wikipedia. Due to the high profile nature of the Covid19 entry on Wikipedia, it's actually quite accurate (due to all the scrutiny).

I also use John Hopkins, but there's also

United States COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

United States Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

and at the end of the day... around 7-7:30 PM central time usually

An interactive visualization of COVID-19 | 91-DIVOC

An interactive, data-forward visualization of COVID-19 data by Prof. Wade at The University of Illinois. Updated daily.

91-divoc.com

But it turns out we're not getting consistent data from US states... Some, like Texas have been caught and criticized padding the numbers.

 

[Montoya]

but a full shutdown should not be an option either.

Yeah, the time for a full shut down has past.

States like Texas want to roll the dice, they can.

Hope for the best, but expect the worst.

 

[Montoya]

I read a lot of what you post, I don't listen to FOX or CNN if I can help it, but I get a lot of news from BBC, CBC, CTV etc, and local news. Life works better that way for me. I find most US media to be way more partisan than I like.

I watch Fox News every morning with my coffee.

Gotta know what my folks are watching!

 

[ColdDog]

I'm actually not a fond of either lol.

Don't tell @Montoya that or we'll end up here

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5g45NX6ZTuM

 

[Montoya]

You will end up in a Bored Gamer video where he takes a 2min topic and stretches out into 15min?

What kind of evil bastard do you think I am?!?!

 

[Aramsolari]

I read a lot of what you post, I don't listen to FOX or CNN if I can help it, but I get a lot of news from BBC, CBC, CTV etc, and local news. Life works better that way for me. I find most US media to be way more partisan than I like.

I have problems with the Corporate 24 hour Cable news networks whether it's CNN, CNBC, or Foxnews. I honestly think we should go back to the days of some stuffy guy in a suit delivering the news for 30min at 6pm and 10pm everyday and leave it at that. Not 10 min of actual news followed by 50min of 'Talking heads' yapping about a subject they often know little about. Rest of the time people can switch their TVs off and look after their kids, read, or play Star Citizen or something lol.

 

[Bambooza]

Again, if Trump simply gave every working American $2000 per month for the next three months, plus told banks to freeze or mortgages, and told insurance companies to halt premium payments, nobody would be rushing to work and tens of thousands of Americans will not have to die in the coming months.

If only the house speaker backed the 2 page 2000 a month to the people bill but instead she went off and released a 1500 page work of pork.

 

[August]

But you can’t monetise short vids!

 

[Aramsolari]

Interesting info for folks in the entertainment industry. I know there's at least one more IATSE member lurking about here.

Home - IATSE, The Union Behind Entertainment

We are IATSE, the union behind entertainment. live events. motion pictures. tradeshows. wardrobe. broadcast. animation. We are 170,000+ behind the scenes entertainment workers strong, working in live events, motion picture and television […]

iatsecares.org

 

[Bambooza]

Completely unscientific but just look at the difference between Asia and Europe/America.

Many Asian countries have a history of wearing masks long before this whole Covid19 thing came about. Japan, Hong Kong, much of Southeast Asia etc. If you're visibly sick and don't wear a mask, you're socially ostracized. Even if you're not visibly sick, you still wear one because it's the socially accepted thing to do (That an air pollution in many of these countries is terrible!). I suppose there's a cultural difference. Western countries value personal freedoms while Asian societies value society over the individual. The Common Good if you will.

I'm not saying one culture is superior to the other, far from it. I believe individual freedoms cultivate innovation and creativity. That being said, it is clearly evident that they're handling Covid19 better than we are. It's not just richer countries like South Korea and Singapore either. Even countries like Vietnam and Thailand are recovering. I have friends and family in that region and many of these countries are reporting new cases in the single and low double digits with no new deaths.

Something to consider I suppose.

I also have to wonder how much their experience with SAR's also played a part with the low death rate and the general use of masks. I would agree that masks are helpful in general for reducing the spread of the virus but it does come at a cost of ones immune not being constantly exposed. Like all things, there is a trade-off between the two, and in this case, I still stand by the idea that the correct response would have been widespread mask usage as the first reaction.

 

[Aramsolari]

I also have to wonder how much their experience with SAR's also played a part with the low death rate and the general use of masks. I would agree that masks are helpful in general for reducing the spread of the virus but it does come at a cost of ones immune not being constantly exposed. Like all things, there is a trade-off between the two, and in this case, I still stand by the idea that the correct response would have been widespread mask usage as the first reaction.

I'll actually argue that many folks in that region probably have a better immune system to folks in North America. Completely anecdotal here but I partly grew up in Southeast Asia and I was rarely if ever sick even though I was often exposed to unhygienic environments (one of my earliest memories was following my mom to a 'Wet' market). Meanwhile a lot of the allergies that are common here (ie. peanut, gluten, soy, etc) are completely unheard of over there. I don't know what is it but there's something to be said about having too sterile an environment. I always tell my helicopter mom of a sister to lay off her daughter for a bit. Let her roll in the mud and get licked by friendly dogs.

 

[Bambooza]

I want to keep a couple things separate:
#1 COVID19 the virus and our response, vs. the response by other govt.'s including the Chinese govt.
#2 China (the people) vs. the Chinese govt.

Without going into much detail, over the last 30 years, we have watched the biggest tech and wealth transfer in the history of the world, as the Chinese govt. has systematically and very planfully tried any and every means possible (ranging from legal to illegal) to get hold of our technology.

The worst part is, we've been watching them do it, and in many ways, making it easier for them! The Chinese govt. very artfully leverages its money and influence to get what they want from US corporations, and the US govt. doesn't really ever coordinate a long-term strategy or response, or stick to one. (I'm pointing out how corporations are prostituting themselves willingly, but China is also artfully spreading money at universities, think-tanks, and using other avenues in the US). And of course, they are doing this all over the world, google their Silk Road initiative, if you haven't.

Here's a prime example: About 30 years ago, the Chinese govt. made a direct copy of a Boeing 707....you'd think Boeing would to make sure that their trade secrets would be kept away from them, but NO, Boeing then turns around and makes deals with the Chinese govt. to start manufacturing aircraft in China and basically hands over the IP and ways to manufacture aircraft. Deals like this have been happening with many, many corporations in virtually every industry.

And of course, being in Australia, you have likely directly seen how China bullies other countries around the South China Sea...for all the trade dealing we do, they are still pretty nasty.

It would be nice to have a coordinated, long-term response to what the Chinese govt. has been doing...this is the best, most thoughtful discussion I've seen in a while:

China's Influence & American Interests: Promoting Constructive Vigilance

This report, written and endorsed by a group of this country’s leading China specialists and students of one-party systems is the result of more than a year of research and represents an attempt to document the extent of China’s expanding influence operations inside the United States. While...

www.hoover.org

There is a YT video where they discuss the report as well, just search for the terms above...

I'm always careful to distinguish the Chinese people from the Chinese govt., because their people are victims of their govt. as well...I think the example of the doctor who tried to sound the alarm about COVID19 and was arrested by the Wuhan authorities is a great example:

This Chinese doctor tried to save lives, but was silenced. Now he has coronavirus | CNN

On December 30, Li Wenliang dropped a bombshell in his medical school alumni group on the popular Chinese messaging app WeChat: seven patients from a local seafood market had been diagnosed with a SARS-like illness and quarantined in his hospital.

www.cnn.com

Western society could leverage our strengths and try to exert more influence with China, but we seem to just ignore that, or be unaware...since our goals seem to be quarterly profits for corporations.

I guess the TL;DR is, we've been watching them do this for 30 years, and yep! we are still watching them do it. Now, we also have the added distraction of COVID19....

At what point do the majority of a countries people become liable and complicit in the actions of their government?

 

[Montoya]

If only the house speaker backed the 2 page 2000 a month to the people bill but instead she went off and released a 1500 page work of pork.

Two pages?

I cant claim to be an expert on the bill, but when there is $2T to hand out and the party handing it out says no time for oversight! Its an emergency! We can probably agree that some of that money is going places it should not.

I dont want to go into a political tangent here, but when the major airlines are letting go of thousands of employees, and getting some bailouts from that $2T, that is to be expected as proper use of the money.

But what about Clay Lacy Aviation? Never heard of it? Me neither, they are a tiny private jet charter. They got $27M because the owner is a big time Trump donor. Not a loan, a grant.

When Obama took $800B to bail out the banks, there was an endless shit storm that followed because bank execs were still getting bonuses and traveling first class on the tax payers dime.

Surely if $2T is about to be handed out, there should be some sort of rules about where it goes and how it is used, something that is more than two pages long.

 

[Bambooza]

I'll actually argue that many folks in that region probably have a better immune system to folks in North America. Completely anecdotal here but I partly grew up in Southeast Asia and I was rarely if ever sick even though I was often exposed to unhygienic environments (one of my earliest memories was following my mom to a 'Wet' market). Meanwhile a lot of the allergies that are common here (ie. peanut, gluten, soy, etc) are completely unheard of over there. I don't know what is it but there's something to be said about having too sterile an environment. I always tell my helicopter mom of a sister to lay off her daughter for a bit. Let her roll in the mud and get licked by friendly dogs.

No, you are right too sterile of an environment is detrimental to one's continued health, which is what I was trying to point out with the continues use of a mask. Use it for the short term spot situations.

 

[Bambooza]

Two pages?

I cant claim to be an expert on the bill, but when there is $2T to hand out and the party handing it out says no time for oversight! Its an emergency! We can probably agree that some of that money is going places it should not.

I dont want to go into a political tangent here, but when the major airlines are letting go of thousands of employees, and getting some bailouts from that $2T, that is to be expected as proper use of the money.

But what about Clay Lacy Aviation? Never heard of it? Me neither, they are a tiny private jet charter. They got $27M because the owner is a big time Trump donor. Not a loan, a grant.

When Obama took $800B to bail out the banks, there was an endless shit storm that followed because bank execs were still getting bonuses and traveling first class on the tax payers dime.

Surely if $2T is about to be handed out, there should be some sort of rules about where it goes and how it is used, something that is more than two pages long.

I am not saying the emergency money for the people act was a great bill. Just that it was clear of special interest in that it simply said give the people 2k a month until unemployment numbers drop. That was all there was to the bill

H.R.6496 - 116th Congress (2019-2020): Emergency Money for the People Act

Summary of H.R.6496 - 116th Congress (2019-2020): Emergency Money for the People Act

www.congress.gov

And I agree these huge bills have so many holes and paybacks for favors which is why I am sad that Nancy ignored two of her own house party members bill and instead released a bill that has no chance and yet continues the trend of special favors put into law.

On this sometimes the simplest action is the best as it doesn't cost much to admin, it gives people a lifeline who needs it while others more spending money to help jump-start the services industry as we know people are terrible about saving money and instead just like to spend it. Which in turn should be the best way to distribute to funds back into companies without political favors being cashed in.

 

[Aramsolari]

No, you are right too sterile of an environment is detrimental to one's continued health, which is what I was trying to point out with the continues use of a mask. Use it for the short term spot situations.

I agree.

That said, even when this pandemic wanes, people in that region will still wear masks. It's sort of become the cultural norm in the past 20 years. There's also the issue of pollution. You'll want to wear a mask too if you're walking around in downtown Bangkok or Shanghai lol. I was in Bangkok a couple of years ago and when I return to my room every night after a full day of walking around, my throat would burn. Felt like I was smoking a pack a day! I've also been to Shanghai and I remember walking up every morning and looking out my hotel room to a sky the color of pea soup. It's nuts.

Funny story but in Japan, women often wear masks even though they're perfectly healthy and aren't afraid of getting sick. I dated a Japanese girl awhile back and she told me women wear masks to keep creepy guys at bay haha.

 

[ColdDog]

Hong Kong: Lawmakers carried out during parliament mayhem

Pro-democracy lawmakers were dragged out by guards during a row partly about the Chinese national anthem.

news.yahoo.com

The bill would criminalise disrespect of the anthem.

 

[Montoya]

Hong Kong: Lawmakers carried out during parliament mayhem

Pro-democracy lawmakers were dragged out by guards during a row partly about the Chinese national anthem.

news.yahoo.com

The bill would criminalise disrespect of the anthem.

This has nothing to do with COVID-19.

 

[ColdDog]

This has nothing to do with COVID-19.

Why else would they wear masks. Social distancing.

 

[Montoya]

Update for the States from Reuters

Where U.S. coronavirus cases are on the rise

The states where the outbreak is growing fastest

graphics.reuters.com

The majority of U.S. states reported a drop in new cases of COVID-19 for the week ended May 17, with only 13 states seeing a rise in infections compared to the previous week, according to a Reuters analysis.

Nearly 90,000 Americans have died of the highly contagious respiratory illness caused by the new coronavirus, an average of about 1,600 a day this month, according to Reuters data.

Tennessee had the biggest weekly increase with 33%. Louisiana saw new cases rise 25%, and Texas reported 22% more cases than in the first week of May, according to the Reuters analysis of data from The COVID Tracking Project, a volunteer-run effort to track the outbreak.

Michigan saw new cases rise 18% after five weeks of declines. Michigan was hit hard early in the outbreak and has seen more than 4,800 deaths.

Nationally, new cases of COVID-19 are down 8% in the last week, helped by continued declines in New York and New Jersey. Nearly all 50 U.S. states, however, have allowed some businesses to reopen and residents to move more freely, raising fears among some health officials of a second wave of outbreaks.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) has recommended states wait for their daily number of new COVID-19 cases to fall for 14 days before easing social distancing restrictions. As of May 17, 13 states had met that criteria, down from 14 states in the prior week, according to the Reuters analysis. Seven of the 12 states have seen new cases fall for three or more weeks. Hawaii has the longest decline in new cases, down for six straight weeks, and had reported only 639 total cases as of May 17.