Let's talk C1

Zookajoe

Space Marshal
Donor
Nov 6, 2016
660
2,755
2,650
RSI Handle
Zookajoe
Is the C1 the Cutty and Lancer killer?

Taking into account that the C1 (stock) has almost twice the range, almost twice the Hydrogen and 1.5x the Quantum fuel. Not to mention almost twice the hull of the other two. Coupled with the fact that if you get creative with the cargo area using the tractor beam, you can carry 120 SCU far out doing the capacity of the Cutty or the Lancer.
For medium freighter cargo hauling, I am thinking we are going to see alot of the former being melted down for the C1.
Does anyone feel that CIG will do something to bring them all into a more balanced state?

1703789447370.png
1703789503905.png
1703789609702.png
 
Last edited:

Graptor

Space Marshal
Jul 21, 2016
210
779
2,300
RSI Handle
Graptor
I don't play as often as many here, so I've always used the Cutty Black as my go to ship to just run some looting runs, some cargo, etc. Hardly ever use my Saber (I'm an awful fighter pilot).

I bought the C1 and the last month or so I've used it exclusively, mostly because it looks good, it seems to fly nice and smoothly, and can do the same runs I'm used to. It has just been a bit more fun to fly! And when I got ambushed on Celin, I was able to outrun those pesky aggressors.

Conclusion: I may just use the Cutty to upgrade to something else, or melt down.
 

Talonsbane

Space Marshal
Donor
Jul 29, 2017
5,725
19,638
3,025
RSI Handle
Talonsbane
Does anyone feel that CIG will do something to bring them all into a more balanced state?

View attachment 25378View attachment 25379View attachment 25380
I'm reasonably sure, based on how CIG seems to want to have lots of options at each tier that each have their own benefits & detriments to provide balance to the group overall, that eventually CIG will find ways to balance out the ships in this group to allow players to choose what they want to use based on their preferences as well as the case scenario. I also believe that the Zeus will join these 3 when it enters the Verse.
 

Dirtbag_Leader

Admiral
Nov 27, 2020
436
1,394
800
RSI Handle
Dirtbag_Leader
I will point out that both the Cutty and Lancer have the additional perk of a mannable turret (though the one on the Lancer really sucks of course), and both also pack a good bit more in terms of missile damage, so they're kind of better cross-functionally as fighters than the C1. I think the closest comparison is actually the Freelancer MAX, though I'd also say that it desperately needs to receive one of the new tractor beams too. It hasn't already gotten on, has it?
 

Zookajoe

Space Marshal
Donor
Nov 6, 2016
660
2,755
2,650
RSI Handle
Zookajoe
I will point out that both the Cutty and Lancer have the additional perk of a mannable turret (though the one on the Lancer really sucks of course), and both also pack a good bit more in terms of missile damage, so they're kind of better cross-functionally as fighters than the C1. I think the closest comparison is actually the Freelancer MAX, though I'd also say that it desperately needs to receive one of the new tractor beams too. It hasn't already gotten on, has it?
True, combat wise the others do have manned turrets. But as a cargo hauler, how often are those manned?

Also, if you will note, the C1 has three times the Capacitor pool and regen rate of the other ships. I feel that this would skew the sustained damage numbers a good bit, if using comparable weapons. It is also slightly more maneuverable and with better acceleration than the others.

True, it does not pack as many missiles, but for cargo hauling, you prime considerations are cargo capacity, range and flight times.

The Max is the closest to matching the C1, outside of the speed, range, and maneuverability. Perhaps that is the attempt at balance, no manned turrets and fewer missiles for improved capacity, range and speed.
 

BUTUZ

Space Marshal
Donor
Apr 8, 2016
3,549
11,954
2,850
RSI Handle
BUTUZ
The C1 is good but so are all the new ships CIG brings out wait a month or two for them to be nerfed left right and center to see where they truly stand.

It is a beginner ship it has weak damage output and very weak shields.

As it stands I've flown it a fair bit mainly because I love the yellow skin - but I'd take my 400i for most general use, or Tauris if I wanted cargo both have much more use and survivability in the grand scheme of things.
 

Richard Bong

Space Marshal
Jul 29, 2017
2,273
6,296
2,850
RSI Handle
McHale
Is the C1 the Cutty and Lancer killer?

Taking into account that the C1 (stock) has almost twice the range, almost twice the Hydrogen and 1.5x the Quantum fuel. Not to mention almost twice the hull of the other two. Coupled with the fact that if you get creative with the cargo area using the tractor beam, you can carry 120 SCU far out doing the capacity of the Cutty or the Lancer.
For medium freighter cargo hauling, I am thinking we are going to see alot of the former being melted down for the C1.
Does anyone feel that CIG will do something to bring them all into a more balanced state?

View attachment 25378View attachment 25379View attachment 25380
The fuel situation is not settled. No ship has it's final fuel values. In fact most ships before the MSR, have fuel values based on component size. A couple from before the MSR, have higher capacities, and expect those to have more range, but anything MSR and later, can't be properly judged.

Also note that carrying cargo, not on a grid, is likely to be a bad idea, like carrying 2 tons of concrete in the back of a quarter ton pickup in the rain.

So those measures you are using for comparidon are likely premature.
 

Lorddarthvik

Space Marshal
Donor
Feb 22, 2016
2,842
9,884
2,860
RSI Handle
Lorddarthvik
Huh, stats keep saying that the C1 flies better than the cutty... I did some combat in it and it sure as hell don't feel like it but it's perfectly adequate enough so I guess the data is correct... Anyways, it's decent at defending itself from the usual low level npc scum.

The lack of missiles is... well, depends on how missilies will get patched. One patch they are OP, the next they are useless.... I did do some VLRT huntin and the stock guns are okay. The missiles were gone fast and didn't do much. But at least it doesn't run out of cap easily. I have seen some mad performances on videos where it did VHRTs, it is capable but sure as hell ain't the best thing for it. As gun stats will be changing a lot still, it's anybodies guess where things will end up.

The cutty feels smaller, easier to get around with, it's got more doors you can actually make use of, I feel like it's more practical when it comes to combat oriented tasks imo. If you have crew mates, at least one can man a turret and be useful.
The C1 is really more of a clean-cut small freighter.
Because so much of the gameplay mechanics depends on having an easy to access ramp and cargospace, and it has guns, it does work as a daily for any task really. But if I were going raiding with a party of 4-6 players I'd still take a cutty for the doors and thus fire support, the extra booster seats, the turret, and for having a smaller crossection for a target. The C1 is a huge effing triangle, hard to miss, the cutty is just sleeker. I just feel like the cutty is more fun when doing stuff in a party.
What I do love about my C1 though is the straightforward design. Cos it's literally just run straight in and you are in the pilot seat, although the doors can be annoying sometimes just like in the cutty.
But most of all I love the Huuuuuuge amounts of booster time it has. You can get out of the "slow zone" on almost any planet with a single full length boost session. The cutty doesn't come anywhere near. This makes it a great machine to use as a main for planet hopping tasks. I used to stick to the stations above the cities so I wouldn't have to climb out of atmo, but for the first time, I don't have to worry about it.

As for Q fuel, for now it's great but that's gonna change, as for H fuel, it eats it up like a racecar. I can't remember a time when I had to go around chasing ports to fill up before the ship was lost and reset. With the C1, you do have to plan for it happening more than once in a couple hour long playsession. It runs out surprisingly fast and it doesn't die easily so you will end up having to feed it. Ofc you could claim it again and again, but it's the first time I don't actually have to once every 2 hours and I like that. It's starting to feel like a game where my ship is actually mine and not just a rental until another 30K hits.

I do daily my C1, I bought it to be my main allrounder along with my original 300i. I had a cutty black loaner for quiet a while and the easy answer is whether you should melt or it not: get both. Both are great at being a solo ship, and they are useful as party transports as well. But they are a different flavor. As the cutty is pretty cheap in game, I'll be pickin one up as soon as I can.

I can't compare it to a Freelancer or MAX, only had a base lancer for a bit when CIG gave us one for some reason and it simply stuck to my account for 2 patches or so. I remember doing bounty missions in it with guns set up for pure alpha. It was fun and waaay more effective than a cutty or the C1. But that was ages ago, much has changed since.

TLDR: as a C1 owner, would I take out a Cutty for a run instead? Yes, I would. Both serve different tasks, have different feel and uses. Keep one, buy the other in-game.
C1 is better a better cargo ship, Cutty is a better multicrew and combat oriented ship. Have both!
 

Zookajoe

Space Marshal
Donor
Nov 6, 2016
660
2,755
2,650
RSI Handle
Zookajoe
The fuel situation is not settled. No ship has it's final fuel values. In fact most ships before the MSR, have fuel values based on component size. A couple from before the MSR, have higher capacities, and expect those to have more range, but anything MSR and later, can't be properly judged.

Also note that carrying cargo, not on a grid, is likely to be a bad idea, like carrying 2 tons of concrete in the back of a quarter ton pickup in the rain.

So those measures you are using for comparidon are likely premature.
I hope so. I really think that the MISC line should be better at the industrial stuff, such as hauling. The Drake line...well, it is Drake, so pirating basically. The Crusader line should be cleaner lines, better flight performance at the cost of more fuel and be less effective at pure hauling capacity.
 

FZD

Space Marshal
Nov 22, 2016
1,378
5,144
2,750
RSI Handle
FZD
Ehh... getting creative can get pretty troublesome tbh, nor is it anything exclusive to C1.
In any case, if you want to focus on cargo exclusively, you should probably not be comparing jack of all trades... es. Jacks of all trades? What's the plural here?

The way I see it, if you want a starter-ish ship to do some combat, trading and mining with, Cutlass Black is a solid, perhaps even the best, choice. Sure it has less cargo space, but that means you can still move cargo just less efficiently. But if you lack firepower, you just won't be able to fight certain opponents - especially when they rework larger ships for master modes and throw in armor.
 

Mudhawk

Vice Admiral
Donor
Oct 30, 2022
551
2,009
500
RSI Handle
Mudhawk
To answer the initial question:
Is the C1 the Cutty and Lancer killer?
Answer: Nope

In slightly more detail:
The C1 sure is a nice ship for the price. But as it is a little more faster and nimble as it's competitors it also has a way bigger ass. Like all Crusader ships except for the fighter range maybe it uses waste of space as a concept. From entry to seat you have to take a long walk with at least 2 doors to keep you waiting. It's no deal breaker but it adds up if you go station to station doing your traveling salesman or bunker thing. Besides the somewhat limited parking space in those places...
The Cutlass may also only have a rear entry but overall traversal times are shorter. The Lancer got a ladder at the side so it takes the crown here.
Well the C1 does have some headroom for creative cargo placement. Only you get stuck in your cockpit with no way out so that's a little daunting.
When it comes to combat I'd rather sit in a Lancer if I got my pick out of these 3. The second shield and fully gimbaled S3 guns sure are nice. Well I got a Tobii 5 so the cockpit layout doesn't bother me too much. I still hope for a Lancer MKII with a better windshield though.
All in all they are all nice ships for your daily business. And the C1 sure comes optionally in the bestest of Test color schemes.
But it's not killing the competition yet and I doubt it will be after everyone got it's gold standard done.
And before you ask, I doubt the Zeus will be blasting away the competition either. At least for single players. I don't really know why but somehow that one practically sreems to me Engineering Teamplay!
May be because of its ancestry... ;-P
 

Richard Bong

Space Marshal
Jul 29, 2017
2,273
6,296
2,850
RSI Handle
McHale
To be fair, I don't have a dog in this fight. My Cutlass is the Blue, so not quite the same idea. The Zeus II MR is the Blue's competition.

There are other ships, that fit in this category that are general purpose and depending on what your actual focus is should be under consideration.
The sweet spot for cargo, at the low end is between 100 and 175 SCU. For daily driver, with roughly the same operating costs you have the Zeus II CL, which we don't have in hand yet, so can't truly compare, then we have the Freelancer Max also in the same base price range. Going up a little in price but keeping the same operating cost, we are now looking at the MSR, the Corsair and the Connie series.
If your goal is hauling then four of these five is likely a better choice (I'm not counting the 75SCU capacity of the Corsair as enough for that). If your goal is more Combat oriented, then the Corsair or Connie may be better.

If your goal is combat, box missions and bunker missions where you are recovering the loot then the 300 series, a Titan or the Nomad might be a better choice if the plan is to stay local, since they are much cheaper to operate.
 

Zookajoe

Space Marshal
Donor
Nov 6, 2016
660
2,755
2,650
RSI Handle
Zookajoe
I was kinda wanting to keep these ship comparisons in the same size category. A S3 sized ship. Comparing S3 to S4 ships is not really a fair comparison, the S3 will lose out every time.
 
  • Like
  • o7
Reactions: FZD and Talonsbane

Talonsbane

Space Marshal
Donor
Jul 29, 2017
5,725
19,638
3,025
RSI Handle
Talonsbane
I was kinda wanting to keep these ship comparisons in the same size category. A S3 sized ship. Comparing S3 to S4 ships is not really a fair comparison, the S3 will lose out every time.
That's why, while I look forward to seeing the various tiers & categories of well rounded ships being balanced as best as possible some day, I also appreciate that moving up from 1 tier to the next in general should improve the overall capability of the players through the use of the improved ships. Which then should provide positive encouragement for new players to have goals to improve their gaming experiences through their efforts to earn funds & reputation in game to upgrade from ship to ship. I'm hoping that this will also benefit the enjoyment of the game for as many as possible to help SC last & grow for as long as possible. Thus we all win, by everybody having things we enjoy more, even if what we enjoy are different than those of others.
 

Richard Bong

Space Marshal
Jul 29, 2017
2,273
6,296
2,850
RSI Handle
McHale
I was kinda wanting to keep these ship comparisons in the same size category. A S3 sized ship. Comparing S3 to S4 ships is not really a fair comparison, the S3 will lose out every time.
I get it. I was looking at it from an operating cost perspective. Since they (with one exception) all use the same components, operating costs should be similar.
And no the S3 ship doesn't automatically lose. The Corsair and Connie hit harder but they have a tougher time getting nose on target and catching a target and they are bigger targets.
 

Zookajoe

Space Marshal
Donor
Nov 6, 2016
660
2,755
2,650
RSI Handle
Zookajoe
I get it. I was looking at it from an operating cost perspective. Since they (with one exception) all use the same components, operating costs should be similar.
And no the S3 ship doesn't automatically lose. The Corsair and Connie hit harder but they have a tougher time getting nose on target and catching a target and they are bigger targets.
Oh, right. I was referring to weapons, range, shields, that sort of thing. S3 just cannot compare to S4 in these categories, which is as it should be, they are after all, a larger ship.
 
  • o7
Reactions: Talonsbane

Talonsbane

Space Marshal
Donor
Jul 29, 2017
5,725
19,638
3,025
RSI Handle
Talonsbane
Oh, right. I was referring to weapons, range, shields, that sort of thing. S3 just cannot compare to S4 in these categories, which is as it should be, they are after all, a larger ship.
This being said, the S7 laser of the Ion, if able to get a solid hit, should be able to 1 shot anything Cutlass / Freelancer / Spirit size & below. The balance is for it to be more difficult to track & hit those ships if they are evading or using their mobility to attack while avoiding being targeted. Same goes for most ships that get nerfed by being caught by surprise or stupidly flying in front of the main weapon of an Idris M.
 
Forgot your password?