Ship upgrading idea: Flagships

Bambooza

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Who says it needs to be PC on PC for Capital Ships?

Scenario...

Vanduul invasion of a fringe system. UEE has requested all available help to help to beat back the invasion or to fight a delaying action until the civilian population can be evacuated.

Available missions: Seek out enemy forces and report back (scouts and explorers); Evacuate Civilians (transports), Bring supplies to the front (haulers), Refuel and repair missions (Vulcans, Starfarers, Crucibles); Recover destroyed fighters (Vulture, Reclaimer); Escort (fighter), and finally Combat missions (fighters, bombers, capital ships, ground assaults, etc)

Counter/PvP missions - pirates looking to capitalize on the invasion. Snatch and Grab (haulers and Troop Transports); Get the WiDoW out - (haulers blockade runners); Find the safe route (scouts); Appropriate the leftovers - Salvage and repair abandoned ships (repair and salvage ships); Protect the base (combat ships); Weaken the UEE (combat and sabotage), etc

I am very sure this will be a thing given how they are building out the dynamic mission system and the amount of work flushing out the Vanduul for SQ42. But as @maynard said even with dynamic missions and some procedural generation the AI code and mission limitations will make them trivial after a while. The best combat will always result in PVP and they are already creating content to help facilitate this with land claims and the mission system that can be utilized by players to create missions.

What we are currently lacking is a payoff for engaging in PVP beyond just because. While small scale pirate PVP can be profitable there is no reason to scale it up to corporate warfare currently beyond fueds. I look forward to seeing what they introduce into the game to fuel the conflict but imagine it's going to be years away as there is still lots of game mechanics that are missing and need to be implemented first.


Back to the original OP question. Test has always struck me as a loose band of friends instead of an organized corporation or collective with clear chains of command. This current structure makes it impractical to focus on power leveling one player or small subset of players. It is much more effective to let the players figure out amongst themselves and their group of friends what tasks to accomplish for the moment. If that small group collectively decides to pool all of their resources into propelling one of their members forward then that is their risk when they do not log in for weeks or jump ship to a new corp.

The organized corporation/Collective typically power levels their leader who then shares the wealth with their lieutenant and they in return share it with their captains and so forth. It works well but in the online community is prone to infighting and power struggles along with absences of any of the leadership positions leading to a quick exodus of the members. Another way is more akin to a club in that weekly dues are collected and with those funds, large projects can be accomplished. Much like Test currently does with the donation box.
 

maynard

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...Another way is more akin to a club in that weekly dues are collected and with those funds, large projects can be accomplished. Much like Test currently does with the donation box.
this

if TEST needs a fleet to defend itself / conquer the PU we will have to pay taxes on our incomes to fund it

the best way to incentivise participation in battle fleets is having an org funded ship replacement program for sanctioned ops

and this is where our size will work to our advantage

Corporate Efficiency FTW
 

Sirus7264

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I was chatting nonsense on Spectrum and came up with a concept that might just work for TEST.

I was thinking about Orgs and how with all the capital ships players are going to have there is going to be a certain degree of inefficiency in upgrading them to their most potent.

Say, for instance, you are in an org with 5 Idris all with LTI do you try to upgrade all of them at one time and it will take X amount of time to get some potent craft, or do you do them one at a time and get a top teir Idris in a 5th of the time with 4 stock loadouts you can use as bruisers while the upgraded one becomes the tip of the spear...

So, a flagship system where the orgs intention is to get every cap ship to max power but in such a way as to minimise the slapdown potential to destruction and insurance claim risk...?

What do we think, could an org the size of TEST benefit from an orderly queue or a free for all?

I don't think anyone is playing the game to wait for their upgrade ticket to be called, but then I don't think having all ships climbing the tech tree at once is going to be very efficient...
one at a time so you can run missions using them which are probably going to go for big bucks.
 

NaffNaffBobFace

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one at a time so you can run missions using them which are probably going to go for big bucks.
Aha, interesting I didn't think of that an upgraded ship likely has a better chance of earning and may even be more economical to run too...
 
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LoicFarris

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Going back to the OP, was there any discussion in Spectrum regarding Org tools? IE perhaps Org leadership prioritizes components for a cap ship and either requests that members contribute credits or outright purchase necessary components and deposit them in a "guild bank."

I hear this talk about Org hangers but don't know when that'll be a thing, it would be nice to have that someday in addition to the tools needed to coordinate efforts that require financial or material contributions.
 

NaffNaffBobFace

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Going back to the OP, was there any discussion in Spectrum regarding Org tools? IE perhaps Org leadership prioritizes components for a cap ship and either requests that members contribute credits or outright purchase necessary components and deposit them in a "guild bank."

I hear this talk about Org hangers but don't know when that'll be a thing, it would be nice to have that someday in addition to the tools needed to coordinate efforts that require financial or material contributions.
No talk about Org tools, it was a chat about capital components being semi-locked to the cap ships they are in and some salty petes being all pissed off they won't be able to pull the reactor out of an 890j and put it in their Reclaimers.
 

LoicFarris

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No talk about Org tools, it was a chat about capital components being semi-locked to the cap ships they are in and some salty petes being all pissed off they won't be able to pull the reactor out of an 890j and put it in their Reclaimers.
Hmm weird, I mean I'd think you could mix and match parts as you wish. If they want to avoid balance issues, then make some parts proprietary, but that in and of it self makes things even more complicated.
 

NaffNaffBobFace

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Hmm weird, I mean I'd think you could mix and match parts as you wish. If they want to avoid balance issues, then make some parts proprietary, but that in and of it self makes things even more complicated.
I think I can see why they have done it...

If you think of larger ships like houses - Yeah I'm able to pull the oven out of the kitchen and put it in another house with minimal modifications required, but I'm not going to simply pull out the central heating system and place it in another building, some parts of a house are woven through the fabric of a building.

Similarly having sub-components in the hull locked components - if I really like the tap on my bath it's possible to pull that out and take it with me to "upgrade" my bath in my new house, but I wouldn't really be able to pull the whole bath and water system out of the old house... and if I did, there is next to no way to ensure even the tub would fit in the new place, anyway.
 

Vavrik

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Hmm weird, I mean I'd think you could mix and match parts as you wish. If they want to avoid balance issues, then make some parts proprietary, but that in and of it self makes things even more complicated.
It's a good question, but I don't think it's weird at all. It's not a question of balance issues to me, it's what have you done with the ship you just removed the parts from? Are you scrapping it? In real life, that's generally what doing that kind of thing means, and the process is incredibly expensive. They do it, but not because it's cheap.
 
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Bambooza

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I think I can see why they have done it...

If you think of larger ships like houses - Yeah I'm able to pull the oven out of the kitchen and put it in another house with minimal modifications required, but I'm not going to simply pull out the central heating system and place it in another building, some parts of a house are woven through the fabric of a building.

Similarly having sub-components in the hull locked components - if I really like the tap on my bath it's possible to pull that out and take it with me to "upgrade" my bath in my new house, but I wouldn't really be able to pull the whole bath and water system out of the old house... and if I did, there is next to no way to ensure even the tub would fit in the new place, anyway.

You mean like this. Cutting a hole in the side of a ship to replace an engine.

13137
 

LoicFarris

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CIG has said that this is basically how replacing capital components is going to work, that's why you have to go to a "dry" dock. Do you think you'll actually be able to see it happen?
That would actually be really cool to watch.
 
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