- Status
I LOVE THIS. This makes me erect.
"This is fine" - ArrangingStars 8/4/15 Tuesday 2:21:21 AM
Last edited:
Well...
Oriental as referring to food, furniture and inanimate objects is not considered a racial slur. It is however when speaking about a person. The slur is fairly old and not really in use today. It is considered a slur because it demeans people as things. There is a whole book on the subject by Edward Said called Orientalism form 1978. The book is actually really good and provides a great perspective on the roots of prejudice, racism and biggotry on a generational scale, or "racism you didn't even know you had", I guess maybe. The book is a treatise on patronizing western perspectives and views of people, societies and regions considered to be Other and less than. The concept of the Other or the big bad monster under the bed that we can blame every social problem on, really big thing in his book and mindblowing topic. Orientalism quinda lumps Asia, East Asia, the Middle East and North Africa together. Go figure.
As far as Mumble goes, I like the idea that we can police ourselves. You know, like adults. Being an adult isn't all about cussing and being able to be rasist or offensive, right? We come to TEST to let our hair down and fun! Yes! But for me that means I would want the ability to have a good conversation in chat about whatever topic. The best conversation I've ever had had some sort of conflict in it and resolution at the end. It could have been we agree to disagree but at the end, I know where the other person is coming from and I know them better. I like that, you know, people. This makes for a better org maybe? Conflict isn't a bad thing in my opinion. It is however important to me to know that i can have a conversation with someone and not be told to stop because we might have children in the room or someone might not think like me or may not like me, period and take offense to what is said.
No one can quantify that. It's just not possible.
We can take actions after the fact but it's a real slippery slope to try to prevent it before it occurs.
Being moved to a more private setting when a particularly good conversation ensues like a seperate room with a Mod I think would work well. The Mod is important I think so that it doesn't devolve. Personal attacks, insults, threats and the like are bad though and that would need concequences. Drugs? which drugs? Some drugs are legal in some states, some are not. With the same drug, Marijuna for example, in one place you can smoke freely in public without any reprecussions and in another, go to jail for the rest of your life.
Personally, when I was in chat, drugs and sex were mentioned here and there but it wasn't pervasive. There was cussing but not anything more than I have heard on youtube. Anything offensive?? Well only Horizonz but that was the best part. That was the fun that I was going to.
What offends me most, more than anything is Politcal Correctness.
GrammarGestapo
Pro Chat Necromancer
DimwitTheWise
Space Marshal
I would say as long as we have the freedom to ask someone to tone something down or change a topic (or move said topic elsewhere), people should be able to chat/joke about whatever. As with most things, extremes (real bigotry) can be dealt with more succinctly, but overall I think we can simply be mindful and engage one another as respectful drunkards. :)
Let us laugh at our differences and similarities. They can be hilarious!
Let us laugh at our differences and similarities. They can be hilarious!
Not really as far as I can see. No moderation is great and all until somebody busts in and monopolizes the entire discussion on some uncomfortable topic. Seen it happen way too many times and just kill all the conversation on Mumble (leading to people to all mute themselves in channel).
We haven't had any problems with racism, mature topics, etc. so far in terms of offending members, the problem is that it creates an uncomfortable atmosphere that leads to either crickets sounds or one person rambling on and on. Which is precisely why members can go to Drunk Tank or create their own personal channels to discuss.
I'm not requesting to cater to children, I'm requesting to cater to tired parents that don't want to explain what a Colombian necktie, or a beef bayonet is to a 3 year old that happened to sit next to him. Of course we won't be drinking tea and playing the harp in General Chat, but just try not to be excessively profane. Also we are not discussing about what is TEST etiquette here but what is the General Chat etiquette. Moderating behavior in one channel doesn't prohibit people from going to another one that has less/no restrictions. Guys you have to understand the mod/officers/admins situation, especially in such a big org. Letting everything lose makes for a very tired LeChuck, Munken, Shive, Seung, Montoya who will have to deal with a crap load of complaints from various offended members. At least having a rule set will allow us to shorten these proceedings if needed from "Hey why did you kick me out of the server for calling that person a beef bayonet loving white nigger?!? There is no rule against profanity!" "-Infinite discussion about moral, ethics, maturity, racial slurs, etc" to "Hey why did you..." -You violated rules #1,#2 hatespeech, personal attacks. Now I will get back in chat/game and ignore you while your ban lasts. kthxbye".
I cannot agree more. I actually suggested that and for some reason everyone jumped me like I was trying to reinstate the 3rd Reich. I cannot understand why to be honest...
Wolf Lord Caldersson
Salt Miner
Just wanted to note, that there has been some idea's about making a "rated R" channel. Montoya and other EvE TEST player might remember that EvE TEST tried the same thing. It just ended up that 90% of the population moved there to talk, and people missed a lot of information and felt "required" to be there to get on operations. Then there was the issue of kids sneaking into these channels and parents getting mad. We don't know if your kid is under your username, we don't know how old your kid is. I was in EvE "Drunk Tank" and me and another war vet that I deployed with were trading stories about some missions we went on. A lot of cussing and in-depth details of what happened. There was maybe 30-40 people in chat just listening. Out of nowhere this mother starts screeching over voice comms how we were corrupting her poor innocent child blah blah blah. I can't control your kids, kids will find a way into what they want. I used the proper channel, we openly promoted we were a "adult focused" group, we had done all we could. I think the best thing we can do is simply promote a 16 or 18+ requirement. This is not a kid friendly org or game, it is going to have sex bots in the game. CR said there would be cursing in the game. This game is not going to be My Little Pony: Island Adventures, it is SC a game about future war and pillaging.
They then tried to "limit speech" and stop the profanity, and member simply started using their own voice chat server causing, again, more information loss in the organization. I think after that and the current policy was simply "As long as it doesn't hurt anyone, it is free to say. If it does hurt you, ask the person to stop. If it continues get a mod."
Issue is that you limit speech in Mumble you will fracture the community into divisions. People will make their own private chat channels, setup their own voice comms, they will go somewhere else. I simply refuse to be limited to remaining in silence for fear of getting a ban, because I cussed too much in a fire fight. We promote 42% more beer, we give the image of a adult org, but then we turned around and have a PG rated voice comms? That doesn't make sense. Leave it as 2 simple rules: "Don't attack TEST and allies", and "Don't be a asshole, with no reason" best way I see it. I do not wish to limit anyone in their speech. I wear headset for this reason and I hate headsets, but it is the only option.
They then tried to "limit speech" and stop the profanity, and member simply started using their own voice chat server causing, again, more information loss in the organization. I think after that and the current policy was simply "As long as it doesn't hurt anyone, it is free to say. If it does hurt you, ask the person to stop. If it continues get a mod."
Issue is that you limit speech in Mumble you will fracture the community into divisions. People will make their own private chat channels, setup their own voice comms, they will go somewhere else. I simply refuse to be limited to remaining in silence for fear of getting a ban, because I cussed too much in a fire fight. We promote 42% more beer, we give the image of a adult org, but then we turned around and have a PG rated voice comms? That doesn't make sense. Leave it as 2 simple rules: "Don't attack TEST and allies", and "Don't be a asshole, with no reason" best way I see it. I do not wish to limit anyone in their speech. I wear headset for this reason and I hate headsets, but it is the only option.
I agree. As someone that has been admining and moderating a teamspeak (and two sister clans) for around two years, the best rules and policies that worked were the simplest ones. General chat has two rules 1: don't be a dick, 2: no singing. and in self mod channels the rules were again 1: don't be a dick, 2: If you are asked to stop, then stop, 3: no singing, 4: The only channel where you can talk over someone else. And as for policy it really came down to if something bothers you say something, and if that doesn't help leave the channel and or tell a mod. And if you make useless/uncalled for complaints all the time you get put on low priority in the moderation que. But we also had a complaint list to track if someone is becoming a problem. This has been the best way to deal with a 1000+ member clan so far.
Side note though, in the dark days when moderation had a heavy hand and strict rules it lead to lots of people no longer coming around to comms and just plain headaches for the moderation staff.
So would I be kicked out? I was warned that TEST doesn't have age restrictions yet when I joined but another suggestion I have is that instead of entirely blocking out u16's , either make sure they're mature or (like I saw a epoch server do) closely monitor their actions before making a yay or nay decision. I joined this org because I had been in serious clans (ik this is a group, calm down) and I hated it. I always just wanted to laugh. Then I saw this After being invited:
And I was like; I need to join
Rite.nao
Huegpaynis
Space Marshal
In your endo.
Mumble should be wild, with a lawman who can keep the peace, and PTT should be the law.
I sell drugs,
My dad sells drugs,
His dad before him sold drugs.
Wanna buy sum drugs?
Y u hate Pharmaceuticals ;_;
On a more serious note, this is an international org where what offends you may not offend me in my culture. Or vice versa.
My Saudi friend would be disgusted that we casually hangout drinking with the opposite gender. While I'm disgusted that he wipes shit off his arse with his left hand?! (Shudder)
If you can't deal with a non-aggressive and unintended offence then you shouldn't interact with the outside world.
If however it was an intended malicious attack then you should scream at that fuckface until they QQ and delete system32.
Glorious leader may then execute them.
My dad sells drugs,
His dad before him sold drugs.
Wanna buy sum drugs?
Y u hate Pharmaceuticals ;_;
On a more serious note, this is an international org where what offends you may not offend me in my culture. Or vice versa.
My Saudi friend would be disgusted that we casually hangout drinking with the opposite gender. While I'm disgusted that he wipes shit off his arse with his left hand?! (Shudder)
If you can't deal with a non-aggressive and unintended offence then you shouldn't interact with the outside world.
If however it was an intended malicious attack then you should scream at that fuckface until they QQ and delete system32.
Glorious leader may then execute them.
Last edited:
Willem Default
Space Marshal
I don't think those who have already joined that are 16 or under should be kicked out, but I think it's pretty clear that TEST is an adult-oriented organisation and Star Citizen is an adult-oriented game so joining while under 18 should be discouraged. For those in TEST already that are under 18 I think should be allowed to stay by all means, as long as they are aware of this fact and act accordingly.So would I be kicked out? I was warned that TEST doesn't have age restrictions yet when I joined but another suggestion I have is that instead of entirely blocking out u16's , either make sure they're mature or (like I saw a epoch server do) closely monitor their actions before making a yay or nay decision. I joined this org because I had been in serious clans (ik this is a group, calm down) and I hated it. I always just wanted to laugh. Then I saw this After being invited:
And I was like; I need to join
Rite.nao
This has all become quite serious, but I think the original premise of OP's question was to set basic etiquette/rules and gage the reaction of the org. TEST is still the most fun and laid back org in SC, we're just setting some (flexible) ground rules for General Chat in Mumble. As has been mentioned repeatedly, other channels on Mumble are much less moderated so it's not really a problem other than maybe in GC.
You make it sound so simple, and perhaps it truly is for you. I just don't think everyone can have that thick of a skin.
For instance:
Do you have a stance in case we get a nut-case that is just straight up annoying - unintentionally of course. Is there any level of annoyance you're not comfortable with?
How about gore-pictures and rape-topics? How does these figure in?
What about people not giving space for anyone else to talk?
Can we have a scientific talk about whether or not IQ-correlates positively or negatively with skin-color?
It's perhaps nice being able to talk about these things, but shouldn't we give space for those are uncomfortable around subjects such as these? Should the once offended or uncomfortable move channel, or should the "offending"-party move. How do we deal with this?
Last edited:
I think we need draw an important distinction here... Gen chat should be reasonably family friendly.
If you are in a gaming channel with 6-8 friends, go nuts.
Another thing to note, as our server, again, is US based we have certain legal liabilities.
Don't come into the mumble and say you just killed/raped/arson/insert hard time crime here. We have to report it.
Doing drugs? Eh, may be legal where your at. My liability is unaffected so do what you want, just keep it out of gen.
I honestly could care less about what's going on topic wise as long as you don't put us in a position where we are obligated to do something.
- Status