The Acolyte

Shadow Reaper

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No axe to grind—just hates this show. No philosophical bent nor bias—just thinks it looks cheap and shitty. I think he’d choke if he knew this was $180M flushed.

BTW, George Lucas developed the CGI at Skywalker Ranch so that he could produce live action SW on a budget. He was never able to get costs down to a reasonable $10M per episode. This series was over$22M per episode, and it still looks cheap and shitty.

View: https://youtu.be/SfSN8kZq7TY?si=w-MsfqUHN_8LEqmD
 
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Shadow Reaper

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Chamberlain nails it when he says this attitude of entitlement and ownership is “sanctimonious”, and Drinker completes the thought when he characterizes it as “narcissistic”. It’s not just the ownership but rather, the justification for pissing off half century of fans just so you can molest and mutilate someone else’s beloved creation. Sick indeed.

Lesbian Space Witches revealed. Don’t watch if you want to avoid spoilers for episode 3. Here’s the inside scoop.
View: https://youtu.be/aaeQoPnixNU?si=4IOxSz5lfCXRXtoO
 
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Shadow Reaper

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So, looks like Disney is lying about the statistics. 4.8 million viewers on a service with 153 million subscribers is 3%. That’s dismal. Seems fans knew what was being offered and didn’t turn out. Who can blame them?

You can say, like Kathleen Kennedy that the problem is all the fans are racist, misogynist and homophobes, or you can say people just don’t want the garbage Disney has been shoveling. Either way, what does Bob Iger say to stakeholders? “Ooops, sorry about your money. We didn’t see this coming.”

Right.

View: https://youtu.be/pzm5xsJiLz8?si=mgPJS0YcoDxpCpng
 

Shadow Reaper

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You have to wonder if when actors and actresses speak out like this it isn’t just shameless brown nosing of the execs. It’s not like she doesn’t know that no one showed up to watch this show. Deciding all the critical voices are bigoted, and wrong, when most didn’t bother to view at all, suggests a serious lack of critical thinking skills.
View: https://youtu.be/62M0VjIS2ig?si=aLw79cJUAGA0LB_C
 

Han Burgundy

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So have you sat down and watched the show yet? Or do you habitually let others form your opinions for you? You like to link video breakdowns that others have created, but I rarely hear an independent thought from you. People are definitely allowed to not like a show. I have zero problem with that. If you watched it and didn't like it, you have every right to critique the art. The issue I have with you, sir Shadow, is that it seems pretty obvious that you don't really watch the things you criticize. You simply have your favorite talking heads on youtube and spout whatever they're saying this week. I think THAT is how you fall down the hole of talking about Gnosticism while everyone else is just trying to enjoy a TV show. There is nothing specific for you to gripe at because you don't watch the actual show, so there ends up this disconnect when you are trying to discuss it with people who have seen the content. Most of us don't really give a shit about Bob Iger and how WOKE the actresses are. Only weirdos spend all their time watching the press tour and arranging rating brigades to bomb a score. Then you have the studio try to counteract that and all you end up getting is the complete nullification of the entire rating process. It is no longer good data regardless of which way it swings. It is a failed dataset.

Homework assignment: Go watch the first episode and come back with 3 examples of how the show is evidence of feminism gone amok...

Holy shit I'm tired of talking about this
 

Shadow Reaper

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As I said in my first post atop this thread, I don’t believe anyone should watch this show. When showrunners make public statements about a project and tell their audience that what they’re doing is going to piss off the majority of fans, I am not okay with that. The only way to stop these maladjusted show runners from deliberately destroying Lucas’ work is to refuse to view their work. There is plenty enough of what they say about their own work to judge the project on this.

When a creator says I’m going to hate what they create, I believe them. I do not then need to go look at the steaming pile they have created. I merely need to point out to others that it is a steaming pile and they ought not step in it.
 
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NaffNaffBobFace

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When the Live Action Netflix Cowboy Bebop was being annihilated before it was even broadcast due to casting a black dude as the originally white Jet Black (of course they'll pretend it was a storm over casting a petite woman as a less petite woman :drunk:) I didn't watch it because I couldn't, it hadn't aired.

When it was being pulled to absolute shreds in its initial run, I didn't watch it as I didn't have Netflix.

When it was a cold slowly decaying husk, and i had Netflix I didn't watch it as I didn't have time.

When I finally watched it the group dynamics were different, the pacing was less of the Jazz Freeform "Sessions" and more of a US Mini-Series Soap-Opera melodrama which was not complimentary to the source material but otherwise, from it's own independent stand-alone point of view, was okay enough. A 6.5 out of 10. It wasn't crap, but it wasn't amazing and unfortunately it really didn't capture that Bebop movie-in-a-half-hour feel the original it was compared to has even today.

If I'd listened to the original annihilation, I'd never have watched it at all.

Go, watch your Star Wars, make your own mind up.

Star Wars Episode 1 wasn't as good as Episodes 4, 5 or 6 which I had seen countless times. I saw Ep 1 once. It wasn't awful like actual crap films are awful, by no means was it really bad, but it didn't get me back to watch Ep 2 or 3. I made my mind up. Not devotion to Lucasarts. Not Reviewers. Not audiences. Me.

And I've been thinking about this for the last few days and I'm ready to say it here: I liked Jar Jar Binks. There. I said it. Look what you've driven me to. I related to that clueless bumblefuck for the frigging incompetent he was and the fan shitstorm about how the character wasn't very grown up is part of what pulled me back from continuing with the other episodes.

I understand the frustration and get it from some angles, I appreciate what Tim has to say about Jar Jar but as Bilbo said, "What about the Ewoks? They were rubbish and you don't complain about them" - Fandom, check yourself, you are most definitely wrecking yourself.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4TX6x2WLgk


I have not seen the Acolyte, I don't have a Disney+ account and won't be getting one for one mini-series. I'll probably finally get to see it once you guys have put it in the ground but I will most certainly not be drawing a conclusion to it until I've actually made my conclusion.

The above clip is from Spaced, and I avoided that show for years based on other peoples opinions - It's a masterpiece and the reason I'll be judging things for myself for years to come.
 
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NomadicHavoc

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I agree. Wether LucasArts or Disney, Star Wars has always been mostly campy. Some people like more or less goofiness in their life...no problems there. I'm certainly not going to belittle people for having opposing views on movies/TV of all things.

I'm not even a Star Wars fanboy but I do enjoy a good sci-fi epic. Historically, my favorite part of the movies has typically been the villains - whether that be Darth Vader, Boba Fett, and Darth Mal. Who doesn't love a great badass villain? But, more recently, I've connected more with the good guys like the Mandalorian and Grogu, Ashoka, and Andor. They are great likable characters. Given that The Acolyte is only 2 episodes in, there's plenty of time to show some good or even great character development and fun story telling. I'm kinda looking forward to see how cool Darth Whatchamacallit may be.

Even if I don't personally fully enjoy The Acolyte, I think that Disney has either maintained a status quo or overall improved on the Star Wars franchise since they took over the reigns in 2012. Looking at some rotten tomatoes matrix below, it seems clear that Disney has done pretty well in most people's view. Plus, they are aggressively trying to expand the universe, which is appreciated.

I rarely re-watch any Star Wars shows, but all this talk is giving me an itch. Sunday afternoon is a great time for a little nostalgia. Now where to start?
 
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Shadow Reaper

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I don’t think there was any controversy over casting Jet as black. I think what caused the controversy was Faye had always been hypersexualized—this tall size 2 with DD cups and paint-on clothes—and they not only presented Faye as modest, but came out and shamed the audience who complained as misogynist.

Complaining about your audience is a sure recipe for disaster. Exactly no one thinks Hollywood is in a position for moralizing. Which brings us back to Headlund.

She’s on this moral crusade to “queer Star Wars” (her words, not mine). The question then immediately becomes on what moral authority she’s doing this. This is the woman Harry Weinstein chose as his Personal Assistant during the years he was molesting people like Kate Beckinsale. How does an enabler end up preaching to anyone about right and wrong and how did she even keep her job in Hollywood? 80 people came forward and accused Harry of 4 decades of villainy. How does anyone survive even tangential contact through that with their job intact and get promoted?

And while we’re beating this horse, how did Oprah survive the sacrifice of Weinstein, especially in light of Rose McGowan’s complaints? Further still on the same issue, how do we not have the list of people who visited Epstein’s island? I think these are all related.
 
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Sky Captain

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When a creator says I’m going to hate what they create, I believe them. I do not then need to go look at the steaming pile they have created. I merely need to point out to others that it is a steaming pile and they ought not step in it.
We all need to choose to be 'builders' or 'destroyers' in our lives.

My only thought is to consider what we are 'building' with this approach of being derogatory about something we have no personal knowledge of.

Cheers!
 

Shadow Reaper

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Well I do have personal knowledge of Gnosticism. I am intimately familiar with gnostics. Just a little side story. . .

I was hired to write a white paper for an investment group looking to enter the disruptive aerospace game. They wanted someone to point them toward where they could invest and get some control over an emergent technology, and I am actually the right guy for that job.

The CEO of this group hired me himself, and we became friends as I did a few months research and wrote the paper. He knew I’m a Christian and confided to me that he’s a gnostic Christian. I pointed out there’s no such thing. Anyone can read Colossians chapter 2 and see what Paul does with gnostics. He refutes them with their own terms and explains no one is above right and wrong.

So I delivered this white paper and this guy started using it to convince other investors to put money into his group—basically he was going to decide what to do with all of these millions.

My problem is that in order to convince people he edited my paper with my name on it and attached to my reputation. He added his name, and went through the entire document removing words like “evidence” and replacing them with words like “proof”.

What he ended up with was a complete lie and fabrication. There was no truth left in the thing at all. We’re not talking about a slight shift in attitude. We’re talking about the kind of lying that puts people in prison for decades. Remember Elizabeth Holmes and Theranos? These lies were far bigger than hers. I think she gets released from prison in 2029.

Gnostic. When we had it out he refused to admit he had done anything wrong. So far as I know, to this day he still maintains editing someone else’s work without their knowledge and consent, in order to swindle people, is just fine. Nothing wrong here.

I was lucky to pick up on what was happening before any investors put their money in, extract myself and straighten out the lies.

Fucking gnostics have no conscience. I know first hand. Satanists are all gnostics—people worshipping the father of lies. All these occult fuckers are worthless pieces of human refuse. There is no lie greater or more destructive than that we are above notions of good and evil. Literally, nothing is worse. This is what Kennedy and Headlund want to sell to hundreds of millions of people around the world—according to them.

View: https://youtu.be/Nymog47zHkI?si=pdR_aWD753EhD4X3
 
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Han Burgundy

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Again, dude, we're talking about the show Star Wars: Acolyte. Since you haven't seen it, I think it is safe to say that your opinion on the matter is invalid. Nobody cares about the morality lesson you seem to insist upon us. Since you put so much faith in blind voting systems, check who is getting the likes on their posts in this thread. It ain't you by a mile. Find something original to say, in your own words, or continue to be greeted by the rest of the community like you have been. It's just kinda...sad at this point.
 

Shadow Reaper

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Again, dude, we’re talking about Gnosticism. You brought up feminism. There’s nothing in this thread about feminism.

Pretty shockingly ironic that you keep going off on what I can’t judge because I haven’t seen it, and continue to drop posts about stuff no one here has made any mention of.

The trailer for the series that caused all the fuss is the one where we hear the pitch that there is no good and evil. The interviews with Headlund and Kennedy that caused all the fuss are where they explain they are deconstructing Lucas’ universe and replacing it with something antithetical. These releases are over a year old now.

Do yourself a favor, go back and read the first post in this thread. That’s what we’re talking about. We’re not arguing about intersectionality, or self-identification, the nature of perversion, or feminism, or anything else you keep pretending. We’re discussing what the showrunner says about her own show. We don’t need to watch it to respond to what we have indeed watched.

There is a reason, Elon Musk commented about the trailer “Reality is actually crazier than the South Park parody.” If you’ve heard Headlund’s comments, you know he is right.
 
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